What are your views on Church of Scientology and Anonymous?

I have seen some of these manuals and paperwork from scientology uploaded by Anonymous it is clear that they are not kidding in the sense that the documentation appears to be the actual documentation but also that informants from inside the church are helping them bring it down they have pictures of complete manuals and there contents as well as a heavy amount of evidense against the curch of scientology. Anonymous states it is not against scientology as a belief but as a corperation i belief Anonymous has left Freezone be (a group practicing scientology for free) if they were against the belief they would attack it.
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finally the bombthreat videos if you have seen them on youtube was released as part on a dvd by scientology against anonymous with these bomb threat videos in dvd quality (now it is impossible turning a youtube flv file into DVD quality) so how come they have the dvd quality versions of the bomb threats against scientology? Makes you think

Scientology? The dregs of rich, bored society.
Anonymous? A really good thing that is starting to rise from the collective. I have hope for the human race with movements like anonymous after their turning to this call. Protect the people from the exploiters. No law can, then have the underground do so.

I think that the Church of Scientology has displayed complete disregard for both civil liberties and civil law in the past and continues to this day to act more like a multi-level marketing scheme then a “religious organization” While some people may find Dianetics useful as a tool for personal improvement, the abuses of “bottom of the pyramid” by management are too well documented to ignore.

As far as Anonymous,if they keep it peaceful, and maybe inspire others to start turning over a few rocks, them more power too them…

First there are many misconceptions about Scientology. The public is misinformed. Let me use your article as an example, you said: “it only accepts six-figure donations to walk through the door”. That is false the Church of Scientology offers life improvement courses for as little as $40 and even offers correspondence courses for as little $25. So if you are not informed, how do you expect the public to be informed and be able to pass a sound judgment? The current public status of Scientology is based in misinformation. Still I haven’t seen the media to nothing to clear this up. I guess we are all afraid of that witch is different regardless of what we think.
Facts about Scientology:
* Scientology is a 100% drug free community.
* Most Scientologist live very successful and happy lives.
* Scientology is the only successful non-Judeo-Christian religion created in the 20th century.
* Scientology is a world wide movement with global impact. There are Churches of Scientology even Japan, Israel and S. Africa. And it has missions even in Nepal, India and Kurdistan(Borak’s home country, ja, ja)
* When you count all the Scientologist from all the planets its numbers are in the millions.

I’m sure that in a century Scientology will be seen no more different than any other religion.

I am so thankful for the internet and that a group like Anonymous exists. Before this, no one person or small group could speak out against Scientology without suffering their wrath of both intimidation and litigation. Now, thanks to the lines of communication and pure caring for those whom they have never met, people can ban together to stand up for what is right.

I know that Anonymous gets bad press for what the group started out as, but things have taken a turn for the better ever since they took to social action. Their ranks extend beyond the messageboards and chat channels of their inception as now people latch on for the cause.

Go Anonymous, you have the silent masses behind you (and they may not stay silent for too much longer).

It’s not that some people think they have information about the “deep and dark secrets”, the information is public knowledge and can be found in public court records. Also, no one is out to destroy Scientology, they want to destroy the Religious Tech Center that owns all the copyrights of their sacred texts. I don’t care what you believe, but you shouldn’t force people to pay for it.

See http://www.WhyAreTheyDead.net for information on Scientology’s many victims.

http://www.XenuTV.net for a more biased approach on Scientology.

If the Church of Scientology were to immediately stop abusing the human rights of its followers, ex-members and critics, and perhaps made its prices more reasonable, then I would have no problem with its continued operation. I don’t understand the stubborn resistance to change from within the organization. Most public Scientologists are really decent caring people. When they get put on staff or recruited into the Sea Org, then they really suffer and start to lose themselves to the Mafia-like side of the cult. Read the stories of people who escaped at exscientologykids.com – there are truly heartbreaking things happening, and even children are suffering.

BEFORE ANONYMOUS I had no idea that:

Scientology broke into government offices and stole records. I had no idea they were convicted (operation snow white).

I didn’t know that the so-called-religion had a “fair-game” policy wherein they attempt to silence their critics, and in some cases destroy their lives.

I didn’t know about “auditing”, and about how auditing so closely resembles hypnosis/brainwashing.

THANK YOU, Anonymous.

What church:

Investigates people

Follows people

Tracks their license plates

Blackmails people with their religious confessionals

Infiltrates the US government (Operation Snowhite)

Attempt to frame people for crimes they did not commit in an attempt to silence them or drive them to suicide (operation freakout)

$cientology destroys families (disconnection and SP declares)

Attacks critics (fair game)

and on and on an on in an attempt to hide their past and continuing crimes.

On the other hand Anonymous works to undress the cult of scientology using documented evidence and peaceful protest.

Is there even a comparison?

About Ivan so-called facts:
* Scientology is a 100% drug free community.
There is a policy on that, but it remains to be seen if it is implemented fully. This policy goes beyond illegal drugs, so that people who might need medical drugs are prevented to do so, with sometimes terrible consequences.
* Most Scientologist live very successful and happy lives.
Scientology staff are paid a pitance, have often a second job to pay the rent and the food. Little insurance, no retirement plans.
* Scientology is the only successful non-Judeo-Christian religion created in the 20th century.
In my opinion, scientology is very similar to the raëlians.
* Scientology is a world wide movement with global impact…
It is a little like the tobbaco companies: looking to new markets to compensate the losses here.
* When you count all the Scientologist from all the planets (sic) its numbers are in the millions.
They count everybody, even those who took one course one day. More serious estimates are 50’000 – 100’000 worldwide.

The so-called “church” of Scientology is a criminal organization.
Have you ever heard of a religion having a secret service similar to the KGB? Scientology does.
In Operation Snow White, thousands of operatives infiltrated the government. 11 were tried and convicted, including Mary Sue Hubbard, the third wife of L. Ron Hubbard, founder of Scientology.
In Operation Freakout, Scientologists infiltrated the personal life of Paulette Cooper, writer of the first book negative towards Scientology, enabling them to (among countless misdeeds) frame her for bomb threats against Scientology.

Scientology believes the soul is eternal and migrates from body to body. Therefore, you already know everything, you just need help remembering it again, which you get through the study og Scientology. Due to this, Scientologists believe kids don’t need a proper education – they have already learned everything, probably several times. Just look at Suri Cruise. She gets to stay up until 11pm and do whatever she wants. How is this raising a child?

The above is just three examples of what the Corporation of Scientology stands for.

Anonymous has fought for two months now, but we’re far from done. We Need YOU to join our cause and speak out about the grave injustices being commited daily by the Corporation of Scientology.

http://www.whyweprotest.net/
http://www.xenu.net/
http://www.lisamcpherson.org/

Thirty year old allegations coming to surface again is not exactly cutting edge activism. Anonymous is overwhelmingly young kids who have been roped into helping with a bigoted attack on a religious group. They are coached to say they are not attacking the Church yet the original videos specifically aim to destroy the Church.
The Church of Scientology is a group of people, just like any other Church. It is the membership and the people involved. I personally knew several of the people who are on the Why are they dead list and they were friends who died of cancer after long battles, medical treatments, and hospitalizations. Being a Scientologist, unfortunately, does not exempt one from getting ill and dying. I also know many Scientologists who have successfully beaten cancer and other medical problems. Scientologists are urged to go to the doctor and work with a medical specialist to cure their disease, if they have one. To see names of friends who have battled cancer valiently and lost is extremely hurtful and unfair.
Anonymous seems to not want to be bothered with the facts but very willing to jump on any old allegation as “the way it is”. Scientologists who defend their faith and find happiness in the Church are scorned and only those few ex-members who have a tale to tell are listened to.
People who actually want to know and care should tour a local Church and see for themselves, meet Scientologists and ask their experience, rather than reading internet stories which are often untrue or extremely biased. One story I read was a girl who was from a wealthy family, had many priviledges, private school, college paid for by her parents, whatever she wanted from her parents but she had a fit when her mother talked to a friend about Scientology! What a horror story (money, private school, friends, parents asking her what she wanted to do, college fully paid for). I wish I had such a terrible childhood.

I’d like to commend you for your choice of the Memphis, TN Church of $cientology, which is now for sale and has only a handful of adherents. That Cof$ sign in the front yard is gone as well, although I’m told they still meet there, at least until the building sells. They have never gained any real toehold in Memphis, fortunately. This evil cult of greed has been shrinking since the mid-80′s, and pretty soon will be gone as we now know it.

And to Ivan Jimenez: The dollar figure is commonly quoted as the price tag to get all the way to OT3, where you find out the real reason you have all your upsets in life. ~$380,000 to find out you’re infested with the spirits of dead aliens, and the only way to get rid of them is with the e-meter, running Incident II (Xenu story) and Incident I (universe is born story). Dang those pesky body thetans. You thought your engrams were bad, wait until you find out you’ve got a BT attached to your scod-sack!

TT

Scientology is L. Ron Hubbard’s creation. He has written so many books, and it is such a huge amount of material to deflect off the simplicity of the subject, that it ensnares with it’s huge long runway of hope for higher spiritual abilities and an improved life.

In my 27 years in the movement, I didn’t even learn of the full theology of Scientology, which is only secretly dispensed with strict muzzling to members who rise up to the levels called OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7.

There are truly some huge problems the movement is faced with due to L. Ron Hubbard’s irreconcilable rules the members are forced to observe.

The two biggest problems are the rules requiring members to label and declare other members and members of the public as “suppressive persons”. This causes the family splitting problem. The simple solution to this most major problem the movement faces, is to declare an “international amnesty” (which they can do, and have done in the past) and un-label all “suppressive persons” which would instantly make family reconnection allowable!

Their second most major problem is the “body thetans” theology. “Body thetans” are the surplus souls/spirits which don’t have bodies, which roam earth today and affix themselves into our bodies, so that in fact, per Scientology/Hubbard theology, the average person has tens of thousands of these body thetans infesting all of us, most of the time. Through Hubbard’s spiritual procedures called OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7, Scientologists detach and free these “body thetans” from their bodies, resulting in spiritual improvement for the Scientologists.

That’s ALL there is to Scientology besides the tons and tons of self help advice.

There are huge penalties for Scientologists to freely tell the public about the spiritual procedures OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 and to discuss how the “body thetans” overpopulation of earth came to be. How the overpopulation of surplus “body thetans” came about is simply that 75 millions years ago a space leader named Xenu committed a massive genocide on earth, and the dead souls of the humanoids he ordered murdered are trapped here on earth, doomed to roam and infest us.

Scientology’s long range goal is freeing each of us up as a spirit ourselves, so that we can freely “exteriorize” (out of the body travel) and longer range “operate” free without a body at all.

All the inbetween doctrines are filler.

The inbetween introductory catechism of Scientology, like their “New Slant On Life” is all beginner stuff.

Once hooked on the intro self help catechism of Scientology, the new Scientologists is guided up the “Bridge to Total Freedom” and the top end of the “Bridge” is OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 where the Scientologists get rid of their loads of “body thetans”.

Chuck Beatty
ex Scientology staffer (1975-2003)
412-260-1170 Pittsburgh, USA (anyone call me anytime!)
http://www.freewebs.com/chuckbeatty77/
http://tinyurl.com/295khy
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05205/542899.stm
http://tinyurl.com/38ptz8 buffalo video
http://tinyurl.com/ywhgaf buffalo poster

Scientology: Half a dozen high school educated actors can’t be wrong.

Scientology: Saving the world one millionaire at a time.

Scientology: And a midget shall lead them.

Scientology: Now with less scurvy.

Scientology: We don’t harrass disaster victims, we care. Really!

Scientology: Don’t take our word for it – Ask Juliette Lewis.

Scientology: Employing the scummiest private investigators, in the entire galactic confederation, so you don’t have to.

Scientology: Have your own indentured servants to wait on you hand and foot or, if you prefer, you can be one.

Scientology: When a one billion year contract is not enough.

Scientology: Thirteenth amendment? What thirteenth amendment?

Scientology: If you join now, Jenna Elfman won’t accuse you of raping babies.

Scientology: Our deceased, disgraced, racist, insane, spittle-emitting, criminal dictator founder can beat up your church figurehead.

Scientology: More B-actors than a Love Boat reunion.

Scientology: We’re here for the untreated mentally ill.

Scientology: We put the mental in fundamental.

Scientology: Join or the sherriff will arrest you.

Scientology: Let he who hasn’t kidnapped a woman from a hospital and starved her to death in a church owned, squalid, cockroach-infested hotel room cast the first stone.

Scientology: Ponzi rhymes with Fonzie. And Fonzie was what? Cool, Fonzie was cool.

Scientology: It’s kind of like winning the lottery, only in reverse.

Scientology: We don’t know nothing about no Xenu

Scientology: Trolls defend us, what more do you need to know?

Scientology: We didn’t want Germany anyway.

Scientology: It’s only an insidious, brain-washing, UFO cult if you look at it from the outside.

Scientology: Overactive sense of humor? We’ll take care of that for you.

The mere question posed here is indicative of what Scientology is. It’s a product, and a deeply flawed, expensive and dangerous one. I vote thumbs down on it, and Consumer Reports would definitely not give it a “Best value” rating.

If we have to tell people not to use a hairdryer while sleeping or in the bathtub, Scientology definitely deserves a six-page warning in the product documentation.

If we have to recall Aquadots because children unknowingly ingest and are poisoned by hallucinogenic chemicals in the liquid, then Scientology deserves a recall.

Why doesn’t the Consumer Products & Safety Commission compel the Church of Scientology to have warning labels?

Examples:
This product is a cult.
Do not use if you value your sanity.
Makers of this product practice false advertising and deceptive trade practices.
This product will split up your family.
This product will severely damage you, your children, and your ability to function as citizens of the broader community.
Use of this product may cause you to be arrested and convicted of stalking, RICO violations, tax evasion, espionage, theft, or kidnapping.
This product will send you into bankruptcy.
This product is dangerous for your physical health, because you will receive no medical care, no psychiatric care, and will be receiving hypnotic suggestions and regular mild electroshocks while using the E-meter.
Training aboard the Freewinds will expose you to asbestos, a known and very carcinogenic substance.
Use of this product requires signing a long “Lisa McPherson” clause that denies you all legal protections, as well as peer-reviewed and scientifically supported medical care.

The E-meter deserves its own warning section in its product documentation. Where is the Underwriters Laboratory when you need them?

If the average citizen were more aware of what Scientology really involves, it would cease to exist for lack of willing consumers.

Scientology is nothing more than a corrupt money making organisation, that sells false hopes and dreams to its many victims. Scientology is responsible for causing many unnecessary deaths. Scientology disconnects family members. Scientology intimidates, blackmails, kidnaps, imprisons and extorts.

Anonymous are not demonstrating against the beliefs of the organisation. People are demonstrating against the corrupt management and structure of the organisation.

The internet provides the proof. All you have to do is look for it.

A current Scientologist in this thread states: “Thirty year old allegations coming to surface again is not exactly cutting edge activism. Anonymous is overwhelmingly young kids who have been roped into helping with a bigoted attack on a religious group. They are coached to say they are not attacking the Church yet the original videos specifically aim to destroy the Church.”

Actually they are not thirty year old allegations, they are facts that are shown to be incidents of things still occurring with the “church”, such as disconnection from families and the harassing of public critics with private investigators and slander. But that the “church” believes Anonymous is just kids who have been coached is something I personally hope they keep believing. In fact the comments about not being against the beliefs but being against the policies of the “church” that keeps children from seeing their parents and has operating prisons inside their compounds TODAY come from an active conscience and an effort to do the right thing.

“The Church of Scientology is a group of people, just like any other Church. It is the membership and the people involved. I personally knew several of the people who are on the Why are they dead list and they were friends who died of cancer after long battles, medical treatments, and hospitalizations. Being a Scientologist, unfortunately, does not exempt one from getting ill and dying.”

In the first place this is not what the “church” actually implies. Their mailed literature (which I still receive) promises freedom from disease and a link to one’s personal rebirth of a native spiritual ability to change the functions of matter itself. There is active innuendo given by people trying to sell you the courses and the auditing that you will be able to separate your spirit from the body and operate fully conscious of your surroundings, completely “at-cause” over matter, energy, space and time. It is instructive to note that L. Ron Hubbard does 20 years ago with psyche drugs in his system per a coroner’s report anyone can access.

“I also know many Scientologists who have successfully beaten cancer and other medical problems. Scientologists are urged to go to the doctor and work with a medical specialist to cure their disease, if they have one. To see names of friends who have battled cancer valiently and lost is extremely hurtful and unfair.”

Many people beat cancer if their condition is caught in time. If the use of Scientology is the specific reason they have been cured then why has the “church” never allowed independent testing and peer review of the methodology? What is of more concern is the amount of people who have died who were not allowed to get competent medical or psychiatric treatment whose stories ended in tragedy.

“Anonymous seems to not want to be bothered with the facts but very willing to jump on any old allegation as “the way it is”.”

This is not an argument, it is an opinion. I hold the same opinion of you, so we can disregard this ploy.

“Scientologists who defend their faith and find happiness in the Church are scorned and only those few ex-members who have a tale to tell are listened to.”

In the first places there are literally thousands of ex-members out in the world. Some have been threatened by the “church” not to speak out against them, and others who have spoken out must experience harassing phone calls, threats of legal action, or even an actual stream of real lawsuits meant to silence and destroy, not to correct an injustice. What is most telling are the amount of ex-members who, having spent hundreds of thousands of dollars to attain the “church’s” highest levels have left and rejected what they’ve learned and are actually currently in the forefront of the criticism.

“People who actually want to know and care should tour a local Church and see for themselves, meet Scientologists and ask their experience, rather than reading internet stories which are often untrue or extremely biased.”

The problem is what will happen to you if you do that. You will be on that mailing list and that call sheet for life, even decades after having asked them to remove your information. That is probably, even, the sole purpose this comment is added here. “Bodies In” is an actual stat they keep.

“One story I read was a girl who was from a wealthy family, had many priviledges, private school, college paid for by her parents, whatever she wanted from her parents but she had a fit when her mother talked to a friend about Scientology! What a horror story (money, private school, friends, parents asking her what she wanted to do, college fully paid for). I wish I had such a terrible childhood.”

It is quite possible, considering all the answers provided above, that the girl’s reaction to her mother’s interest was one of concern for her mother’s life, health and sanity.

first of all, bgodly? i would like to adopt you.
i have firsthand knowledge of the human trafficking that the $cieno’s are doing at flag in clearwater. they are enslaving thirdworld country teenagers to do their manual labor. the teens are living under horrific conditions. the abuse is so bad that high-ranking $cieno’s from inside flag have contacted someone from the outside to try to get someone to help these teens.
amnesty international southern division is looking into these allegations and is trying to help us.
how do you like your cult now, A $cientologist?
$cientology is imploding from within…we have insider info on this, too. it’s only a matter of time. anonymous is already working on helping these people when this all falls.
governmental agencies, churches, and organizations have all been contacted to tell them that when this falls apart…there will be many people who are going to need a lot of help from all of us.
expect us to protest
AND
expect us to help those who are going to be left when this cult falls apart.
THIS IS WHY
WE ARE LEGION

Scientology is a thousand times worse than Enron. The only reason the media has yet to expose them and report the abuses is the cult’s litigious nature. They use threats to keep the truth from making it to mainstream news. One day, Scientology will provide decades of case study and many journalistic awards. This is the BIGGEST con EVER! The crimes that Anonymous “alleges” are not allegations, they are fact, people have gone to prison, the documents are from court records. There is nothing fake about our claims. If only the media and government would grow a set of balls and stand up against these goons we would have months of news material more shocking than the war! It’s dumbfounding that the cult is even still in exsistance anymore, but they are great at lying and covering their butts. Anonymous is just providing the FACTS, this isnt new, just unreported, thanks to the media, the abuses continue. Now members of Anonymous have been stalked, threatened and even had our pets murdered by OSA (Scientology’s terrorist wing)and the P.I.’s they hire. Stupid things are in the news that don’t even qualify as news yet this goes unreported!

How on earth can anyone compare Scientology to any actual religion? They obviously do not know the harm it has caused people and is still causing in the name of money. The all mighty dollar is what the religion is about.

You really need to do some research and question every aspect of Scientology, especially;

* Scientology’s harassment and litigious policies against its critics. Can you imagine a church hiring private investigators to research your background looking for anything they can use to discredit you? The answer is no, but the Church of Scientology does. And why? Protection of copyrights? What church has copyrights? It’s because they won’t make any money if people are able to offer services for free.

* Scientology’s attempts to force search engines and websites to omit critical information about them. Now they’ve even gone after eBay saying that I, as a person and the rightful owner of an e-meter can’t sell it on eBay. Why? Who are they to tell me I can’t sell something that I bought with my own money?

* Scientology’s belief that they are the only ones that can help the world ( they want to make the world “clear” – i.e world domination ), thus being intolerant of other religions – something they fight for when it’s their religion being attacked. (cults believe that they are the only ones that know the “truth”). The US against THEM mentality.

* Scientology’s disconnection policy, which requires members to cut all ties to friends and family considered “antagonistic” towards the religion (a basic practice of all cults). No other religion does this. This alone is enough to cause red flags. It has broken so many families and separated love ones from each other. Why? Because they don’t want to lose anyone, that’s why. Do you really think that a Jewish person would be told, by any Christian church, to “disconnect” from his/her family if she wants to be a good Christian? No. But Scientology does. It forces you to, or guess what, you can never get over the “Bridge of Total Freedom”. They even make you play with clay and put images of your family in front of a clay bridge for you to understand the impact. The image? Your family is in the way.

* Scientology’s affirmation that anything written by L Ron Hubbard is the true and definitive word. It can not be altered or disputed (a single messianic figure, another basic practice of all cults). Is he really that much starter than everyone else in the world? Come on… really? LRH was a paranoid psychopath along the same lines as Howard Hughes. Smart? Definitely… and a prolific writer, but the man had one goal. Make Money. Make More Money. Have Others Make Money for You. It is this unvarnished demand for money that has led many observers to opine that the entire operation looks more like a business than a religion “Among the things that have made this movement so controversial,” says S. Scott Bartchy, director of the Center for the Study of Religion at UCLA, “are its claims that its forms of therapy are ‘scientific’ and that the ‘truth’ will only be revealed to those who have the money to purchase advancement to the various levels”.

* Scientology’s organizational structure ( OSA – Intelligence Department, RPF – Justice Department; free labor for the church), ethics policies and security checks. No other religion does this. Imagine a pastor asking you questions about where you where or about the conversations you had with friends or family to see if you’ve said or done anything against the Church, then writing them down and keeping it in a file. This is Scientology’s Sec Checks. If you fail, you go to the RPF to get right.

* Scientology’s auditing, which the Church says is like a confessional, but it’s more like talk therapy, only the Church keeps track of what you say. They keep everything on file. They keep a file on everyone. They even write up reports ( KR- Knowledge Reports ) on you and put these into the file. Does the Catholic Church keep a file of all your confessions? No. Scientology does. They use this information against you if you ever say anything negative about the Church. And if you ask for your file back, they won’t give it to you.

* Scientology’s military uniforms and ranks. Naval uniforms to be specific, because Hubbard always wanted to be a big Naval officer and failed. So this was his way of accomplishing his dream. Question why military? No other religion does this. Always be aware of any military groups, especially those that want to conquer the world. I’m sorry.. “Help” the world, because they are the only ones that can.

* Scientology’s attack on psychiatry solely because psychiatry attacked L Ron Hubbard for practicing medicine without a license and having no scientific proof that his form of psychotherapy worked. ( To this day, the only proof they have is Scientologists saying that it does…There’s no science behind Scientology ) L Ron Hubbard turned Dianetics into Scientology in order to continue to make money and avoid criminal charges. Ask yourself, why psycs? Hmmm.. Do you think that maybe it’s because they are in direct competition for psychotherapy dollars? Yet, Scientology can’t cure any metal illness. Naronon and Criminon are staging platforms for new recruits. If you pass these orgs then maybe you’ll be able to handle Scientology, otherwise they don’t want you. Did you know that Hubbard himself requested psychiatric assistance from the V.A.?

* Scientology’s contribution scheme which requires you to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to reach the highest level of their “Bridge to Total Freedom”. Making money is the sole functions of each “org” – organization – aka “mission” ( KSW – Keep Scientology Working is their motto). Ask yourself.. why charge if the purpose is help people and clear the world? Wouldn’t the world be clear quicker if was free? Wouldn’t people gladly give ( donate ) money for “saving” them? We’re not talking $300. We’re talking $300,000.00. This “contribution” is mandatory. It isn’t optional. It’s not like passing the plate around. If you don’t pay, you can’t be helped, that is unless you join the Church staff. In that case, the Church still counts it and charges you for “services” if you ever leave the church. Imagine having to pay to learn about Abraham, Isaac, or Moses if you were Jewish, or about the crucifixion and the resurrection within a Christian church. Jews and Christians don’t charge for their “secrets”. Even other religions like the Mormons will send you a copy of their “Book of Mormon” for free and Jehovah Witnesses will come to your house and talk to you freely about their religion.

* Scientology’s misleading images of using the crucifix ( a symbol of Christianity ), the words “Mission” and “Minister” to promote their psychotherapy as a religion (Scientologists do not believe in Christ. L Ron Hubbard said that all religions are noting more than an implant on our souls forced upon us by an evil war lord named xenu. Religion was created in 600 BC by people “using a piece of R6” implant. Scientology is not tolerant of any other religion. It can’t be because it goes against everything L Ron Hubbard teaches and he isn’t wrong… is he? Ask yourself… why the cross? I know about the 8 dynamics, but why not just 8 lines intersecting each other or an 8 side figure? Why use something that looks like a crucifix? It is maybe to mislead people into thinking that Scientologists are in some way Christians?

* Scientology’s deceptive marketing strategies used to lure you into the church to take courses intended to help you achieve your “full potential”. These include the “Free Personality Test”, that always points out problems they can help you with but only if you paid them, and through frontline organizations such as WISE, ABLE, The Way to Happiness and Applied Scholastics which introduces potential members (including school age children) to the teachings of L Ron Hubbard and his made up terminology (which requires a Scientology dictionary to understand). Ask yourself… why “courses”, books and videos and lectures that you have to pay for? Why not just teach the religion for free in churches? Why deceive people like this? Why? Because it’s the only way you’ll get their money!! Get them in and then intimidate them not to leave. If they do leave, call, send mailings and harass them to come back.

* Scientology’s conflicting statements about L. Ron Hubbard’s life, in particular false accounts of Hubbard’s education (he flunked out of George Washington University and never attended Princeton), credentials (he was never a Civil Engineer nor a Nuclear Scientist or had a PhD), military career (he was never a WWII Hero. In fact, he was decommissioned twice, once for accidentally ordering his ship to fire upon Mexico – It wasn’t until he created the Sea Org that he gave himself the title of “Commodore” and made everyone wear naval uniforms that he finally achieved his dream of being a great naval officer) and lastly his great expeditions (2 failed attempts one trying to make a movie and the other searching buried gold). He also abandoned his first wife and children while he went on these “adventures”, cheated on his wife, committed bigamy, tried to kidnap his daughter from his second wife and was himself on medication at the time of his death. If the man lied about himself… and is a “great” Science Fiction writer… ask yourself, can you really trust him to tell you the truth? Why did all his explorations and accomplishments stop after founding the Church? Because he didn’t need the money.

Scientology is based on lies and the ego of one man. It is a global scam. Unfortunately people still get sucked in and trapped into it.

Don’t accept a lie in order to obtain freedom (further OT levels). This doesn’t fly. Freedom is truth.

Seriously, though, I wonder how much RTC pays you $cilons to poast on the internets.

Scientology is helpful. If you ask the people who do it they will tell you they find it helpful. This means better income, better communication, enjoying life a little more, a little less stress because you understand the source of stress better, things like that. Learning about the religion online, that’s free. Walking in the door, that’s free. Its first courses cost a little something, but not a lot. Big Pharma is afraid of this kind of help. Heh.

Thanks, Chuck for everything you’re doing. God Bless you.

IF it was a religion, I would call it by its name. Unfortunately it isn’t, so I persist in calling it CULT. And there are many reasons to call it a CULT.
1. It’s all about money. No money? SUCKER!
2. It’s about mind control. From the first Training Routines a person’s mind is being manipulated to become a highly gullible person that believes everything the CULT tells you. E.G. that criticism is orgnaized and financed by psychiatry.
3. It destroys families by Disconnection. Ask Jenna Miscavige-Hill, David Miscavige’s niece: She knows all about it.
4. It has an elite corps called Sea Org, that also does act as an secret service: What religion needs a secret service?! These people are even subjected to slave labor and prison camps when not walking the line! What religion has slave labor camps?!
5. Within the Sea Org children barely see their parents. Jenna Miscavige told she could see her parents once a year. Others tell the same story.
6. They have a libel and slander website. What other religion has a hate side about their critics?
7. Critics are always called “anti-religious extremists”, because they expose the atrocities committed by the CULT.
And on, and on.
In the end, the CULT aims for world domination. A world where the CULT as absolute power. The first thing that comes in mind: A world dominated and ruled by the CULT is an exact copy of today’s North Korea: Totalitarian, dictatorial, inhumane, no personal freedom, no freedom of speech.
Find out yourself:
http://www.xenu.net
http://www.lermanet.com
http://www.scamofscientology.nl

Scientology is nothing but a cult, and a mind
control vehicle to make money off the public..
it is not a religion and should be outlawed &
banned..Run by money & power hungry shysters..
Avoid it at all cost..

I think that it is fantastic that people are able to see things that are wrong in our world and say that they are not going to sit back and they are going to do something about it.

Scientology was created as a Master Race group by L. Ron Hubbard, who called Scientologists “Homo Novis.” From the Latin, the “New Men” created by Scientology processing claim to be experts on the mind, education, and justice. Yet, when we see Tom Cruise in action in the leaked Scientology videos, we see ignorance and brutality of any Master Race cultist. Compounding his Master Race doctrine, L. Ron Hubbard called for a Scientology genocide against the 2.5% of the global population that he deemed to be the defective incurables, the “SP’s” who suppressed Scientology’s expansion. David Miscavige, Hubbard’s successor and the absolute Dictator-for-Life of Scientology, has never renounced Hubbard’s Master Race doctrines, nor has he renounced Scientology’s Fair Game doctrines against its critics, RPF, and Disconnection. Scientology remains an isolationist Master Race group whose cultural illiteracy and violent suppression of Free Speech arise from its insane goals to destroy all human forms of government, education, and medicine and to replace them in favor of an absolute Scientology dictatorship. The insanity of Scientology explains why this Cult is collapsing internally and is presently the subject of immense global protests designed to draw attention to the true danger of this Cult.

/////

Scientology wants to destroy your “reactive mind.”

guess what? your “reactive mind” contains your “bullshit detector.”

the last thing $cientology wants are critical thinkers.

Hey now, this scientology stuff sounds kinda scary. I think I’ll stay away from it. Besides, I’m handicapped; from what I read online, Scientology thinks that is my fault somehow, something about alien souls stuck to me.

Personally I prefer my medical physician to treat my scoliosis, not some crazy person.

“Scientology is helpful. If you ask the people who do it they will tell you they find it helpful. This means better income, better communication, enjoying life a little more, a little less stress because you understand the source of stress better, things like that. Learning about the religion online, that’s free. Walking in the door, that’s free. Its first courses cost a little something, but not a lot. Big Pharma is afraid of this kind of help. Heh.”

Thus spake the Scientologist. “Big Pharma” as you call it is not afraid of Scientology. “Big Pharma” has methods that WORK and have been PEER REVIEWED.

Would you rather get a $20 FDA-approved steak, or a $200 one sold by a hobo on the street?

Scientology is not just some whacky cult that can be ignored it is the most insideous and dangerous cult today. You only need to look as some of the videos that anonymous has put on YouTube that are extracts of $cientology’s own videos to see this. They are intent on “clearing” the planet, which I gather means making everyone a scientologist or a scientologist sympathiser.

Although such a grandious scheme may seem unlikely to succeed the fact that it is being pursued with all the aggression of a Bond like criminal organisation and the fact that the Cult of Scientology has incredible resources make it worthy of protest; it is one cult that cannot merely be ignored. Go anonymous, go and anything I can do to help I will.

It is not true! You don’t need a six figure donation to join scientology. You just need money to make real progress. Either that, or work for the church, or sign a BILLION YEAR CONTRACT (this is not a joke).

Walking through the doors is cheap. Earning salvation for your thetan is expensive.

Give me some more information here.
Only a few people are defending.

Ask me, it seems nobody is really ‘for’ this
nonsense.
Over 9000 people were at the worldwide protests,
No violence occurred (just a couple noise violations).

Scientology is evil to the core. If you look into it further, it will always, inevitably prove to be worse than you thought.

Jenna Miscavige Hill, Astra Woodcraft, and Kendra Wiseman–women who grew up in $cientology and left and are the children of high-ranking $cientologists can’t be wrong.

as an anon, i see it as my goal to bring about the purification of the internet and humanity through the simplest means, these being “tough love” ie trolling. scientology is under the impression that it is untouchable, that it is some justice league type conglomeration of people protecting humanity. when in reality all they do is exploit, ruin, and destroy. they call us terrorists, but we havent infiltraited the government or committed treason. we just watch plane crash and laff. we rickroll, goatse, ddos, botnet, and pump. they murder, lie, cheat, burn, destroy and charge a hefty ammount of money for it. i am opposed to those who exhibit a two faced mentality, as an anon i have come to grips with the horror that is the human condition, and have no problem with someone believing that he is some analy raped alien ghost, i have a problem with someone making money off of it, and doing so without taxation by the government. ask yourself a simple question, if scientology wasnt a cult, it wouldnt require money or secrecy. look at the freemasons, you dont see them filing dmcas on all the vids supposedly exposing them, and you see most of the money going into them flowing back into the community. scientology on the otherhand sees buying out and converting the community and then sucking all the money and life out of it as helping. instead of giving drug addicts methadone or similar substances, they give them vitamins. instead of giving a schitzephrenic his medication, they give him orange juice and vitamins. again the dogma is not what is hated, it is the practice. and we will continue to cut away at the practice until the dogma is all that remains. we represent what they hate, we represent freedom, we represent actual democracy, in that we are a hive with no queen, we act as an ameoba, whe do not all agree on everything, but when most of us agree on something similar, the results are nothing short of spectacular. we are legion, we can not be stopped, never forgive, never forget. expect us.

It strikes me as funny that when any Scientologist defends their religion… on a page asking for their views of Scientology and Anonymous… they get accused of being paid by RTC. What is really funny is that it is well know that many Anonymous protesters are being paid to picket… oh well.

Is Anonymous aware that this “operation snow white” they speak of was done before RTC existed?

It is 2008.

The Church complies with all laws, or there would be constant arrests and trials… but there are none.

I understand that the foot soldiers of Anonymous feel they are doing the right thing, but they are being manipulated by a hidden few. Their facts are being warped to suit an agenda.

Metaphor: Let’s say there was a restaurant… and a bunch of people say they hate it despite never eating there, and a few people who did eat there now hate it (and a couple of them stole some silverware). However, many many more people who have eaten there love it. They say it’s great and recommend it.

Are you only going to take the recommendation of the people who never ate there, and only a few who have? Or are you going to listen to everyone and make your decision based on that?

You can look at the issue from both sides and decide. But you must look at the issue from both sides! Not just the one side. The people who are influencing Anons are making wild criminal claims against the church. But, if there was a shred of truth in those claims, the FBI, police, etc would be conducting investigations… and they’re not. The only actual criminal activity (by a very small number of Scientologists) happened 30 years ago, before the current Church leadership was in place. And this leadership was put in place so such activity never occurs again.

There is a doctrine in the church, (and I am paraphrasing) “what’s true is what’s true for you”.

I ask that each individual decide for himself and not follow the herd mentality.

That’s my two cents.

I am a supporter of Anonymous, and have Participated in both the Feb 10 and the March 15 Protests.

The Church of Scientology has a record of crimes from Harassment, (Alleged) Murder, and even Treason (Google: Operation Snow White)

Now, a group that has committed these crimes, as well as Censorship of the Media… One does not deserve to continue on in my own opinion… but I do not see any reason they should have the right to not have to pay taxes on the hundreds of thousands of dollars that they embezzle from their followers.

We came on 2/10… we came on 3/15…
We Will Come Again in April…
We Will Come Again in May…
We Will Come Again in June and July…
We will Come Until that Wall of Silence is Rubble.

We Are Anonymous
We Are Legion
And We Are Here

Scientology did not work for Martine Boublil

There is breaking news in France that she was held against her will in a filthy room as part of something called “Isolation Watch”

http://www.rue89.com/2008/03/18/scientologie-les-dessous-de-laffaire-martine-boublil

It is good she was rescued or she could have become another instance like Lisa McPherson

“What is really funny is that it is well know that many Anonymous protesters are being paid to picket… oh well.”

i know of nobody who is paid. i spent about 20 dollars on bus fair (don’t want you getting my license plate number) 200 fliers to hand out, food, water.

all of my fliers were gone within hours and i shall spend about 40 dollars next time.

you campaign of misinformation is no longer allowed.

expect us.
we are legion.

It is a pay-as-you-go cult. It doesn’t deserve the tax exemption status that is currently enjoying. It was founded by a sci-fi writer that spoke about how the big bucks were in creating your own religion. You don’t have to mentally leap THAT far to figure out what it is about. I suppose it is hard to make any sound judgments when you are brainwashed, though. The SP and the PTS thing is simply childish. It reminds me of Jr. High drama. But when things like that are enforced, and you are told to write “disconnect letters” to your family, and private investigators are called, etc, I can see how people can be fearful of retribution. Anonymous is doing a good thing.

ScninLA says:
“It strikes me as funny that when any Scientologist defends their religion… on a page asking for their views of Scientology and Anonymous… they get accused of being paid by RTC. What is really funny is that it is well know that many Anonymous protesters are being paid to picket… oh well.”

Who is paying which picketers and where do I line up for my check? I don’t know about the Religious Technology Center, but I do know we need more proof than you say so. Produce evidence to back up your claims or admit to the neutral reader that you’re just bullbaiting again.

“Is Anonymous aware that this “operation snow white” they speak of was done before RTC existed?
It is 2008.”

I’m not really sure what Anonymous is aware of, but Operation Snow White was written by L Ron Hubbard – who is given a great holiday – and landed his wife in jail while he hid out from the feds. What kind of a religious leader writes up operations for the infiltration of the US government to expunge negative records held on him and then fingers his wife when the heat gets too hot? Google Operation Snow White, and see what this great guru hath wrought. A guy like this deserves a holiday??

“The Church complies with all laws, or there would be constant arrests and trials… but there are none.”

Not necessarily how it works and is a poor try. The lack of arrests or trials does not indicate the lack of crimes, it indicates the lack of prosecution. We’ll wait for the next shoe.

“I understand that the foot soldiers of Anonymous feel they are doing the right thing, but they are being manipulated by a hidden few. Their facts are being warped to suit an agenda.”

Who? Proof. What agenda? Proof. Produce the documents or recordings and – I know – put it on You Tube! Start.

“You can look at the issue from both sides and decide. But you must look at the issue from both sides! Not just the one side. The people who are influencing Anons are making wild criminal claims against the church. But, if there was a shred of truth in those claims, the FBI, police, etc would be conducting investigations… and they’re not.”

First – The metaphor wass too compound. It creates a strawman and has no final truth inside. The conclusion of it isn’t even the point you needed to make there. Second – You need to take a look at the material being smuggled out of the organization even so far as today. Can you see what’s missing? Is the guy next to you leaking it? How many security checks have you had or run in the last month? But Third – investigations aren’t announced with trumpets.

“The only actual criminal activity (by a very small number of Scientologists) happened 30 years ago, before the current Church leadership was in place. And this leadership was put in place so such activity never occurs again.”

Except for the Rehabilitation Project Force living in dungeons and cells and not allowed to see their kids or spouses, who are sometimes eventually ordered to disown them. Where’s Heber? The old crimes may or may not be being committed. But there are some new ones we’ve become very interested in. The current leadership wasn’t put into place to prevent these kinds of crimes. It put itself in power after Hubbard died to take control of the organization. How many more escaping ex-staff need to say that before you yourself wake up about it?

“There is a doctrine in the church, (and I am paraphrasing) “what’s true is what’s true for you”.”

Except any recognized version of epistemology questions that with devastating effect, but I do understand that that way of thinking allows for a moral relativity that makes your arguments against your opponents pointless. Because if what’s true is what’s true for them, you can’t dispute with them.

You need to reconsider your position. Scientology is about to be exposed and dismantled in France even as we speak. That’s just the start. You don’t know what is happening behind the scenes. There is a hidden data line that you are not a terminal on. Don’t be there when the next batch of felonies are prosecuted. There’s still time for you.

Grab the stuff you need to go state’s evidence and get into the WP program. Meisner did.

““What is really funny is that it is well know that many Anonymous protesters are being paid to picket… oh well.”

i know of nobody who is paid. i spent about 20 dollars on bus fair (don’t want you getting my license plate number) 200 fliers to hand out, food, water.

all of my fliers were gone within hours and i shall spend about 40 dollars next time.

you campaign of misinformation is no longer allowed.”

a) Looks like you got a raw deal…

b) YOUR campaign of misinformation is no longer allowed. Because I just said so…

so much for intelligent conversation.

ScninLA, if you believe we are doing this for money you are daft.

Btw, if you need a leader, I can tell you who it is. David Miscavige. Through his abuse of his own staff, his lies and tyrantical behavior he has proven that he is the ultimate SP behind the plight of many Scientologists.

He has altered the tech, he is slowly writing out L. Ron Hubbard. He is what is ‘pulling in’ criticism of Scientology.

the “plight of many Scientologists”?

what about the success and happiness of millions of Scientologists?

and maybe the those suffering from this “plight” should take a look in the mirror instead of blaming others for the problems.

If Scientology has really helped so many people Where are these millions?

See the following website http://www.exscientologykids.com
and http://www.scientologydisconnection.com/ this kind of stuff has happened to far too many people for far too long.

Anonymous has said Enough is Enough Scientology-you can’t hide behind behind a veil anymore.

If you want to find out what Scientology is really all about, there are now 82 videos you can watch, launched just the other day, at http://www.scientology.org They cover the fundamental beliefs, what’s it’s like to be a Scientologist, the human rights work the church does, the drug rehabs, disaster relief and a whole lot more. The most important video, I think, is the one Called “Love & Hate – What is Greatness”. I think it should be required viewing for most of the people that have commented on this story – Here it is: http://www.scientology.org/index.html?video=what_is_greatness

it’s hard to have an intelligent conversation when you are talking to someone who is brainwashed. many protestors being paid? you have absolutely no facts behind that yet you state it as fact.

we’ve read your emails. we are on the inside and the outside. we are everywhere. we are legion.

“what about the success and happiness of millions of Scientologists?”

another lie. according to official u.s. census data there are only roughly 55,000 scientologists in the u.s.

yet “the church” likes to claim millions because anyone who has ever taken a personality test is automatically a follower. inflating numbers to keep the money flowing. the brainwashing goes on.

To ScninLA:

You said: “There is a doctrine in the church, (and I am paraphrasing) “what’s true is what’s true for you”.”

That’s a universal scientology justification for believing anything you are required to believe by LRH or David Miscavige. Along with the definition of reality you subscribe to; i.e. ‘reality is that which is agreed upon’, these two dicta form just about the most dangerous philosophical standpoint available to people. The mindset which results insulates you from objective truth and objective reality, both of which exist independently of your subjectivity. Truth is real, facts matter, and you can’t just not-is them. You can have your own opinions, you can even have your own beliefs, but you cannot have your own facts, or your own reality. Some day – maybe today – reality will slam into you like a juggernaut. And it’s happening courtesy of Anonymous.

May the light of truth shine on you too; I wish you well.

An ex-scientologist, who didn’t steal any silverware, but wants his time and money back.

ScninLA, i have said this before; Anecdotal evidence means nothing. The Aum Shinrikyo cult in Japan had members who worked on computers in offices, and members they locked in solitary confinement and gave LSD. You may not have yet come into conflict with the Church of Scientology, but dozens upon dozens of members and ex-members have had their money, livelihood, and lives taken from them by the practices of the Church of Scientology. You cannot simply say that such abuses never happened.

There is certainly not millions of scientologists. Here are a few links to some of that data about there being only 55,000 Scientologists in the US if anyone’s interested.

http://www.lermanet.com/howmany.htm

of course if you think they’re biased you can look here.

http://www.adherents.com/rel_USA.html#religions

If you think they’re biased you can look here.

http://www.gc.cuny.edu/faculty/research_briefs/aris/aris_index.htm

I’m pretty sure the Graduate School of the City University of New York isn’t biased.

“What is really funny is that it is well know that many Anonymous protesters are being paid to picket… oh well.”

That’s the thing about the Marcabians… they say they pay well, but the radioactive income tax is a killer. I haven’t seen a seen a cent. :/

However, Kendra promised me a kiss if I ever see her. ^_^

http://www.exscientologykids.com

CULT

Dear ScninLA:
We are supposed to get paid? Sonofa…where is my check at? Is this part of the vast conspiracy that Scientology talks about with us being a Marcabian Invasion Fleet financed by Big Pharm, the Mental Health Industry, and the Germans? Do the Illuminati fit into this somehow?

Anyhow, when you get it all worked out where I pick up my check at, you let me know mmmkay?

I know this is difficult to wrap you head around, but none of us are paid, none of us are following orders, we don’t report to any leader, we don’t have a secret clubhouse to meet at. We are just the rise of social conscienceness. We are each individuals who feel that Scientology has been allowed to conduct their crimes against humanity in the shadows for far too long. We want the truth revealed, and have come together to see that it is.

You defense seems to be if you are doing wrong, the authorities would have stepped in. They haven’t because of incidents such as Operation Snow White where you bent Due Process to your advantage and launched mass lawsuits against the IRS to effectively pigeonhole thier efforts.

Most of your arguments are based in fallacy and the practice of dismissal and flawed logic. You no doubt picked up this in the analysis of the logical fallacies in L. Ron Hubbard’s ‘Introduction to Scientology Ethics’. You aren’t the only people versed in such things. In other words, your Jedi Mind Tricks won’t exactly work on us.

It, coupled with your aggressive litigation tactics may work on one or a few people, but Anonymous is something you have never faced before. It will be the undoing of the abuses your organization has enjoyed carrying out unchallenged for far too long.

Those walls of fallacy are showing signs of structural damage, and I’m pretty sure they are starting to crumble. The light of truth is shining through the cracks and casting shadows aside.

“Operation freakout was 30 years ago scientology doesn’t do that anymore.” “Fair Game was canceled”. “Scientology doesn’t harass critics.”

I beg to difer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2lQhiNQ008

whatever, guys.

If there are so few of us, as you claim, what are you so worried about then?

There are 4000 members in my one church alone, and I’ve personally met each of them. If anything, the actual number of Scientologists worldwide is actually underreported. Most just don’t hang out at the computer all day responding to criticism. They get out there and make a difference where it counts – in real life. They are very busy people.

Scientology is a bait and switch scam. It baits people with promises of personal improvement courses, then traps them in a tangled web of lies, all the while selling them their bogus therapy for extortionate prices. Only people trapped in a cult mindset could believe the unbelievable and unproven claims made for Scientology’s miracle cures. These miracle cures are dangerous to people’s health, because they prevent people from accessing real medical treatment and preventable diseases are not prevented.

The primary reason the damage this criminal scam does isn’t more widely known, is because of the mafia at the head of the organization, that uses terrorism and vexatious lawsuites to silence criticism of Scientology’s abuses.

“The Church complies with all laws, or there would be constant arrests and trials… but there are none.”

here are 3

http://glosslip.com/2008/02/27/germany-shows-consistent-in-its-zero-tolerance-policy-towards-church-of-scientology-shuts-down-kindergartern-run-by-cos/

http://www.theage.com.au/news/World/Scientologists-charged-in-Belgium/2007/09/05/1188783270166.html

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/07/12/europe/EU-GEN-Russia-Scientology.php

What’s this? Almost another Lisa:

http://www.rue89.com/2008/03/18/scientologie-les-dessous-de-laffaire-martine-boublil

Scientology Management does not always tell the truth;
Scientology Management has condoned, conducted and been
convicted of illegal,unethical and immoral activities;
Some Scientology Practices are dangerous to participants health,
either physical or mental or both;
Scientology Management and L.R. Hubbard lied about Hubbards life
history and accomplishments;
Despite the pseudo-scientific claims of Hubbard no Scientology or
Dianetic process has *ever* been clinically *proven* to work as
claimed.

I have been circulating the above, in one form or another
since 1999.

Were the above not true, then they would be defamations of
Corporate Scientology and we both know Co$ has the money and the
lawyers to force me to retract or cease to utter or print them.

But the above *are* true.
And the first four are enforced by *current* Co$ policies.

Scientology is not a religion, never has been, never will be. They mimic one to be able to survive legal questions about their fraudlent products. It is a classic bait and switch scam.
Not only does the Corporation of Scientology embrace terroristic methods to control its staff and upper level members it exports that social economic and psychological terror as a tactic to destroy and detractors or vocal defectors.
See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VT5wNBKhYIE
for more a synopsis of the criminality of this mock religion but the shame it brings on the US for protecting and fostering it with special privileges and even US Govt Mailings advertising the Corporation of Scientology.

I feel sorry for lower level members. They are like frogs dropped in the pot with the heat on low. Soon it will boil and they will be cooked and never realize it.

Gregg Hagglund SP7
TorontoSP

I think that if a person wants to know about Scientology he/she should just read Scientology books like “fondaments of thought” and see if the data are useful for him or not.
The problem with anonymous is that the want to destroy a religion, so they are “I hate you” kind of people. And this kind of people usually lie and every information they receive get worsened and passed to other. As they pass “data” amongst themselves these data become further and further from the truth and the end results is what appears in the articles from anonymous….
They are an hate group and should be ignored or if something has to be done with them, they should be investigated.

You critics really make me laugh. Really. In the face of happy, successful people you remain persistently angry, persistently antagonistic. It is first boring, then a little alarming. And finally, just plain amusing. Hell, sniff the spring air, get the idea?

I am not sure what you were going for here Daniel (the author of the initial discussion) but I don’t know if this “discussion” is what you intially intended. It think at this point if you post something about Scientology it will be quickly followed by a slew of mockery and acidic statements by a very active few. One would believe that L. Ron Hubbard was the devil incarnate after following some of these posts.

The problem aside from the content of these criticisms is the the delivery. You can read much of the above and feel the hate and anger oozing out of some of these sentences.

I don’t know about you but I don’t readily accept opinions and advice of an angry person. I for one will readily admit some of my own worst decisions were made when I was angry or fearful. This type of emotion may be good in a bar fisticuffs but it doesn’t serve well when discussing someone else’s guilt.

I am not sure if you will get this far down the string in reading responses but I would like you to know that there is one guy who has found Scientology to be as throughly workable for helping someone as anything else he has run across. It has assited my life in a host of things. I am definitly more successful and I continue to work at taking life on instead of it taking me on. You may find that this comment will be followed by some who may try and tone down their communication in response but there will be some who miss the boat entirely and will continue to fill their commentary with as many disparaging remarks as possible.

Hi, Terryeo.

Question: How happy and successful do you have to be in order to get repeatedly banned from Wikipedia for being abusive to the other members?

I’m persistently as happy as a clam at high tide.

Welcome Terryeo,
I like to listen to both sides of any debate, so I am glad you have spoken up. I’m not angry, I’m not trying to be antagonistic. I do sniff the spring air and appreciate the good things that Scientology does sometimes.

But tell me why I should ignore reports of ongoing abuses? Martine Boublil (rescued from unlawful detention by 4 Scientologists in January 2008) describes a terrifying ordeal that suggests the Church of Scientology of today treats people the same way it treated Lisa McPherson in 1995. Why are ex-members describing how minors are aggressively recruited into the Sea Org, then forced to work long hours with little pay in the Sea Org?

Scientology is the only self help course that does not have to pay taxes on the money it makes. You go to a college and they have to pay taxes. Weight watchers has to pay taxes.

Re: ScninLA
Metaphor: Let’s say there was a restaurant… and a bunch of people say they hate it despite never eating there, and a few people who did eat there now hate it (and a couple of them stole some silverware). However, many many more people who have eaten there love it. They say it’s great and recommend it.

Metaphor: Let’s say there was a country… and a bunch of people say they hate it despite never living there, and a few people who did live there now hate it (and a couple of them stole some silverware). However, many many more people who have lived there love it. They say it’s great and recommend it. Germany 1939 – 1940. Jonestown 1978.

Scientologists regularly use metaphors to skim over and avoid explaining damaging facts about their cult.

http://www.scientology.org make your own mind up one way or the other!

Tell me, if the whole Xenu story is fake, then why has the CoS spent so much sueing and harrasing those who publish or disseminate it? If somebody said “Religion X secretly believes xyz”, and they just denounced whatever was said as a daft rumour and ignored it, nobody would take much notice of it and the accuser would be seen as a kook. Jumping up and down in fury like the Co$ just shines a huge spotlight on the whole Xenu story, which has been proven to be central Co$ doctrine in an American court of law. The church spent over $1 700 000 to try to stop ex Scientologist Arnie Lerma hosting the information on his website AND LOST. For more info http://www.lermanet.com/cos/4oct96.html

Of course the CoS entitled to believe what they want. What they’re not entitled to do is spread lies, harrass people, abuse members, extort money, violate labour laws, suppress free speech and so on. That is why Anonymous is fighting them. Want more info?

http://www.whyweprotest.net
http://www.xenu.net
http://www.enturbulation.org
http://www.lermanet.com
http://www.xenu-directory.net/ (particularly good database of critical information backed up with fact.)

I have looked at Scientology.orgs webbsite and my opinion has not changed at all.In fact it makes me angry,angry because on one of the videos i watched someone say with regards youth for Human Rights:
Quote:L.Ron Hubbard had the courage and the vision to put this together and says these are rights that belong to all of us,and here it is,go for it,we can do it.

I have a major problem with that statement as i saw first hand L. Ron Hubbards “human rights”, they include locking people up, putting children in a chain locker,degrading people and throwing them over the side of a ship.Also keeping me from seeing my own parent,and causing that parent to have a breakdown. I am not the only one, see Anon above time 1:16.Plenty of evidence of Scientologys’ human rights there.

Look at http//:www.exscientologykids.com and make up your own mind.

Human Rights or Blind?

You $cientologists who just keep lying and lying in the face of overwhelming, rock-solid evidence…you crack me up.

Remember back before you joined the cult? You probably thought lying was a bad thing. Now look at you.

i know for a fact…i have seen it with my own eyes what they’re doing to these teenagers at flag in clearwater, florida.
these are thirdworld teenagers whose parents were duped into coming to the united states of america to start a new life in the same “church” as tom cruise and john travolta.
the family gets to america and are put into introspection rundown which is basically starving them, depriving them of sleep, making them sit in sweatboxes, making them take dangerous amounts of niacin while bombarding them with $cieno info. after they are sufficiently BROKEN, the parents are asked to give up guardianship of these teens. the parents are sent off someplace else and the teens “volunteer” to work as slaves for the cult for an “allowance.”
many of them speak little or no english. they are watched constantly. their hours are brutal. their passports are being held from them. they get no schooling except for auditing sessions and studying $cientology. their living conditions are deplorable.
the condtions are so much worse these days that high ranking $cieno’s from flag were even appalled and have contacted an outside source to try to get help for these teens!
the teens know they can’t even walk away if they wanted to: they don’t know where their parents are and they don’t have their passports.
to all the $cieno’s who are reading this:
why don’t you care about these teenagers?
why don’t you question your own organization?
why don’t you call flag in clearwater yourself and ask why they’re doing this?

these teens are watched so closely that no one can get close enough to them to try to talk to them. they’re forbidden to even say hello to anyone that greets them. they just drop their heads if a non-$cieno speaks to them.

the only organization whose hands are not bound by having to have a name of these kids is amnesty international…and they are listening to us.

why don’t you care about this?

why?

don’t tell me it’s not happening…i’ve seen with my own eyes these kids at work. i’ve heard from people that i know and trust about what’s going on with these teens.
i’m a 50 year old floral designer and a notary here in florida. i’m not some superhacker on steroids.

your cult helps no one. every “program” you have requires money from the person that’s being “helped.”
a poor man can’t be a $cientologist.
it can cost up to $375,000 to achieve the highest spiritual enlightment within your cult.
there are members of your cult who work their whole lives and never achieve that. their whole lives and they never get enough money to reach the highest level of your cult.

april 12th…expect us.

THIS IS WHY
WE ARE LEGION

William Hagglund,

I could spend days responding to the criticisms that are off handedly thrown at the Church. I do not have any pretended goal to convince you or some other critics of the merits of the Church. I have a feeling that you don’t really care.

If you truly cared about people and their plights as you profess in your discussions of the abuse of Scientology you would take a step back and look at yourself and the things you say or incite.
How much trouble do you aid in causing others on your way to some noble goal as you state? It seems you would be willing to slander and abuse the rights of thousands to protect against harrasment of some ex-Scientologist as you claim.
There may not be any who find my comments here and understand what I say but I will communicate it nevertheless.

I read a comment section today about Katie Holmes who went out to have some lunch. Just lunch mind you and the comments left were all very harsh, calling her a whore, a mindless robot and other such things. She is a very, very, very sweet person as any who know her would tell you. This is an example of many of Anonymous simply lacking any respect or decency for another person.

This is not about illegal behavior or immoral conduct by the church. That, I am afraid is a complete ruse. This has all the smackings of a con of sorts used to vent as much negative spin in the environment as possible. Sound harsh? Nothing harsher by any stretch than what some of your group say and do.

Why do people act this way? Why do they take up this call and mock and degrade beyond anyone else’s stomache for it? It woudl seem a little off that these folks spend a good portion of their time falling this activity.

Well, the answer is probably unique for every individual. However, I think we can ask ourselves the same question of why there is a KKK?, why we had the Crusades?, why do we have terrorism?, why were Christians thrown to the lions?, why do people step on each other on their way to corporate success?, and why do we have a culture of dwindling freedoms and antagosism towards our neighbors?

I am very certain that this group will say too much too often for too long. At one point you are going to be asked to prove your claims. Not just a posted comment referring to a 30 year judicial opinion or some scorned ex-scientologist but hard cold verifiable proof. If on that day you arrive only with the stuff you have already repeated there will be a personal reckoning for you and you will have to answer for your activities.

We will see what lies behind this campaign. Truth always wins. Alterations and mockery don’t. If Anonymous held cold facts in their hands there would be no need for the mockery and name calling and debased communication. Period.

The Church of Scientology is being attacked like many other organizations have been, it is not new. I have known about them for now 8 years and have read from numerous of their books and have encountered a genuine attempt to educate and awaken people from a sleeplike condition many of US have had concerning the state of our current society.

When a society has been gradually duped into a belief that social chaos is “normal” and it simply “occurs” and that there isn’t anyone actively ceating this confusion (surely for financial gains)the society doesn’t realize there is even hope for anything different. Our “reality” seems unchangeable or bearly changeable. When a group like the scientologists come to shift that paradigm…shake some ground under our feet!!! BOOM BOOM BOOM! the mess starts!

I know there are MULTIBILLION dollar companies behind the attack on the church of Scientology! These “ANNONYMOUS” are but a sign of the insidious forms these attacks take! These companies have often kept (w/ their money and influence) us simply fooled!

I know the Church (maybe not perfect, of course) but I KNOW THEM, their members, their intentions, their ideals and it is VERY VERY respectable! it deserves nothing but an intelligent look before one jumps into ill-informed conclusions!!! I gave it a try and so should all us!

The garbage people spread about Scientology is just amazing. Like “the church only accepts 6 figure donations” – How could anyone really believe such nonsense? The first course I did in Scientology cost me $10. That was in 1977. I’m on a course right now that cost me $35 ($70 if you include the materials). There are courses that cost a lot more, sure, but I can choose to do them or not, so what’s the big deal?

As for “Anonymous”. The computers they used to attack Church of Scientology web sites are the same ones that send out the spam and phishing emails you get in your inbox. Wow, real trustworthy, believable guys.

bgodley,

Firstly about Katie Holmes and harsh comments made by anonymous people, do you know what ‘anonymous’ means? It is the lack of a name. A person making fun of Katie Holmes then signing as anonymous could be anyone! Most of the anonymous people protesting the abuses committed by the Church of Scientology feel sorry for Ms Holmes (have you not heard the reports of how Scientology is controlling her life?).

Personally I do not hate any Scientologist. I feel it is my duty to Scientoloists to protect them from the abusive cult that seeks to exploit them.

You are correct in saying truth always wins.
Truth – the sworn testimony of Astra Woodcraft.
Truth – the documented kidnapping and unlawful detention of Martine Boublil.
Truth – the chorus of crimes recounted by exscientologists and family members of current scientologists.

bgodly,
I hope you are right when you say truth always wins.
There is plenty of evidence of the horrendous abuses committed by the cult of Scientology. For example,
the sworn testimony of Astra Woodcraft, and many exscientologists like her, as well as the documented kidnapping and unlawful detention of Martine Boublil in January 2008, with 4 Scientologists arrested.

And you should keep in mind that people commenting anonymously about Katie Holmes are not necessarily the same anonymous people outraged by the human rights abuses of the cult of Scientology.

If you spend a lot of time reading the responses to news reports on Scientology, as I do, you begin to see a pattern. The only comments supporting Scn are from “church” members — you never see any independent third party who steps up and says “Scientology is Swell!” The rest of us (i.e., the other 99.999% of the planet) thing it’s a silly, stupid, dangerous cult.

Anonymous has the cold, hard facts in their hands, and they are using them. Your attempts to shift the attention away from the crimes of your so-called church are laughable. Truth does indeed win, and in this age of information there is no place for an organisation that relys so heavily on hiding it.

Your game is over, bgodley et al.

I am not at all angry, but here are some facts about Hubbard:
Direct Quote:
“For instance, the historic Jesus was not nearly the sainted figure has been made out to be. In addition to being a lover of young boys and men. he was given to uncontrollable bursts of temper and hatred that belied the general message of love, understanding and other typical Marcab PR. You have only to look at the history his teachings
inspired to see where it all inevitably leads. It Is historic fact and yet man still clings to the ideal. so deep and insidious is the biologic implanting.”

From:

HUBBARD COMMUNICATIONS OFFICE
Saint Hill Manor. East Grinstead, Sussex

HCO BULLETIN OF 5 MAY 1980

The statement that a person has to have a six figure donotion to get in the door of the Scientoloty Center is not true. I am retired and absolutely do not have even a six figured monthly check, and I have taken courses at the Scientology Life Improvement center that have helped me greatly, and they didn’t cost anywhere near a six figure amount! The employees were very gracious to me, an I study both at the center and at home.

True, there are injustices in this world. That is one of the reason I like Scientology. If ever an injustice occurs, one can contact the International Justice Chief and get the matter reviewed and rectified. I’ll bet not a single critic has bothered to really follow the procedures set up to fix their perceived injustice. Dare I say that maybe it’s because they know their “facts” can’t stand up to an impartial review? Or they’re not willing to make amends for the damage they caused to their former friends and the agreements they shattered.

So, instead of trying to do anything effective to handle their situation, they just try to destroy the Church and all those it has helped.

No real Scientologist is going to stop being a Scientologist simply because a few people are hell bent on attacking and don’t care to take responsibility for their own condition in life.

That’s what’s true for me, and my game is just gettin’ started!

“http://www.scientology.org make your own mind up one way or the other!”

news reports coming out in france today are stating that people in those videos aren’t who they are reported as being in the video. the positions listed next to them are made up and in some cases that is the person who holds the position.

many of the u.s. senators and politicians in the video are reporting that they had no idea that their image/video was being used to promote scientology. they claim that they are not scientologists and have never taken any courses.

cult propoganda
cult propoganda
cult propoganda
cult propoganda

“http://www.scientology.org make your own mind up one way or the other!”

news reports coming out in france today are stating that people in those videos aren’t who they are reported as being in the video. the positions listed next to them are made up and in some cases that isn’t the person who holds the position.

many of the u.s. senators and politicians in the video are reporting that they had no idea that their image/video was being used to promote scientology. they claim that they are not scientologists and have never taken any courses.

cult propoganda
cult propoganda
cult propoganda
cult propoganda

Anonymous,

I am not sure what you are talking about regarding the news reports from France but I would kindly ask you to list the us senators and politicians that you say were videod and then somehow had no idea they were promoting Scientology. If you can provide this with reference to the quote from those individuals I would like to verify that for myself.

If you can’t I am afraid you need to watch what you say and please be more responsible in not creating sensationalism.

http://forums.enturbulation.org/showthread.php?t=5085

you can read all about it here bgodley

Check out the link from anonymous ay 4:58 am. This time you have been truly found out. Any comment bgodley?

Some snippets from the statement of Jeff Hawkins, long time OSA:

“I worked at the Int Base for about 15 years before I encountered DM’s
violence. I never knew that DM physically assaulted staff. It’s a well
kept secret, even at the Base. It isn’t talked about. It was only when
I began to regularly attends meetings with him that I discovered that
he does assault staff, and viciously. Over the last few years I was
there, it was getting increasingly worse.”

Suddenly, and without warning, he leapt up on the conference room
table and launched himself at me. He slammed me up against a wooden
partition and proceeded to hit me in the face. Then he threw me to the
floor. I was in complete shock. I ended up laying on the floor with my
legs entangled in his. “Let go of my legs!” he screamed. I did. Then
he walked out of the room.

I was shaking, my shirt was torn, and my face stinging. An exec near
me said “Get up, get up – don’t make him WRONG.” Imagine that. I’ve
just been assaulted by the Chairman of the Board RTC, the head of
Scientology, and all they can think of is to “not make him wrong.”

Once when I was up in the “RTC Building” (Building 50), taking a tour
of the place with other execs, DM was passing me as he left one of the
rooms and suddenly, without warning, rabbit-punched me in the stomach.
He then said “I can smell Black PR a mile away,” and walked off. I
tried to reply but I literally could not speak of breathe for a few
seconds.

Another time, he hit me several times in the face and actually drew
blood. He signaled to his assistant, Laurisse (“Lou”) Stuckenbrock,
and she produced a vial of mercurochrome from her purse and proceeded
to dab it on my face. Like, this was business as usual. He said to me
at the time, “You know why I beat you up?” I said “No, Sir.” He said
“To show you who’s boss.” He literally said this.

Another time he was talking to myself and Rick Cruzen, and he said,
“Look at him (meaning me – he loves to talk about people as if they
are not there). He’d like to take a swing at me. And you know what? I
hope he does. Because then I could REALLY unload on him.” Exact quote.

The Scientology propaganda video in question has a testimonial from an unnamed “member of the cabinet of the mayor of Marseille” Municipal staff were contacted and after some investigation concluded “this document is a forgery that we have to transmit to the office of mayor with a view to possible action on our part.”
A testimonial in the video supposedly from the Council of European Communities, Brussels has similarly been proven to be fraudulent.
Several other testimonials on the video are yet to be verified.

The original French article may be accessed here: http://www.bakchich.info/article3073.html
An imperfect Google translation accessible here: http://www.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bakchich.info%2Farticle3073.html&langpair=fr%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF8

There has been a strong denial from the Family Justice Center in Tampa. The woman interviewed by Scientology is upset she has been falsely represented and does not approve the use of her comments in this Scientology propaganda.

How apropos that CoS is being presented here as a product. That is exactly what it is.

To address some nonsense here:

1. Anonymous protesters are not paid. Most have spent their own money, moved by the dictates of their own conscience. Kindly produce the paper trail that indicates anyone has been paid.

2. Old CoS tactics of “attack, never defend” are failing. They do not work against an ever-growing group of anonymous average citizens. You can unmask a dozen and harass them, but this is no longer going to work, thanks to the Internet and digital cameras and mobile phones. New technology keeps the harassed from being completely alone and unsupported. You harass a critic exercising their right to express their opinion, and ten more critics get interested in investigating the cult of Scientology for themselves.

3. Anonymous does not “hate” Scientologists. In fact, Anonymous has expressed love and concern for Scientologists forced to disconnect from non-CoS family and friends, love and concern for Scientologists who get sent to the Reclamation project Force gulags, love and concern for Scientologists who pay and pay and pay (up to an estimated $300,000 US) their way up The Bridge only to find that OT8 is all about a crazy space opera with an intergalactic overlord named Xenu and “body thetans.” If Scns want to believe they are infested with dead space alien cooties, that is their business. As with anything that costs that much money, though, the individual must decide if it is worth spending that much money for a poorly-written science fiction fantasy.

4. The calculated plan to woo celebrities into the cult is backfiring. Celebrities who openly embrace Scientology are ruining their careers. They are becoming figures of fun, not adulation. I feel sorry for them.

5. L. Ron’s “accomplishments” as described by the cult are exaggerated or false.

6. What are YOUR crimes? Have you convinced yourself that your ethics are so superior and beyond reproach that it excuses lies, disinformation, attacking critics, fragmenting families, plaguing members for more money, and ignoring common sense? Is it really logical that ALL critical non-church information about the CoS, including information from former high-rank CoS members, is wrong? What are you not allowed to read? What are you not allowed to hear?

7. Low-level Scientologists tend to be well-meaning, sincere people who have good intentions. I believe this. I think the entry-level tech is intriguing to the average CoSer. I can understand why someone on this level would be saddened and alarmed to hear all the criticism, because–at that point–the tech seems to work for them. Folks here get love-bombed by their new best friends in the church and get some basic (and not unique to CoS) coping techniques that they can use to get some relief from whatever their personal life blocks may be. I can see how CoS would seem like a great thing. If the tech appeals, ask why you are discouraged from trying the identical tech as used by FreeZoners. See how long you can go without parting with some cash, and how long it takes before you are being called and hassled and cajoled to SPEND MOAR. Knowledge is free. Religion, in every case but the CoS, is free–even tithing is voluntary.

8. The funniest and craziest explanations about Anonymous: it’s a government plot! it’s German psychiatrists! it’s an invasion fleet from Marcabia (outer space)! it’s a bunch of cyber-terrorists! it’s a hate group! In fact, the more CoS’s policies and abuses are exposed to the light of day and the public’s critical eye, the crazier and sillier these “explanations” get. It is apparently impossible for CoS folks to grasp that average folks from all walks of life are opening their eyes, doing some research, and saying “careful now; down with this sort of thing.”

9. What church needs private investigators? privatedicks.org

10. What church hides behind front groups (Narconon, Crimonon, Applied Scholastics, dozens more)? If Scientology is so awesome and effective, why does it need front groups? Could it be because the church has a horrible and well-deserved negative reputation, and there is no way the average citizen wants to have anything to do with it? If the tech is perfect and works so well, why, after decades, haven’t people embraced it independently without this kind of sneakiness? People do use what works, after all. There must be a reason why, after decades, the entire world hasn’t embraced LRH tech as the answer. It’s not like it’s THAT new, or that only a handful of people have tried it. It’s been tried. It causes more harm than good–in the long run. It is that simple.

11. What church needs a bunch of weaponry, such as the stockpiles at Hemet?

12. What church needs to try to kill free speech on USENET newsgroups and forums? Why would dissent be a bad thing if the CoS is above reproach? People criticize Christianity every day, and it doesn’t hurt Christians. They may not LIKE it, but they don’t go on sprees trying to squelch any whisper of negativity.

13. If the CoS is truly able to cure various diseases, why do the rates of death from various causes mirror, exactly, the causes of death of non-CoS? Scientologists do not live longer or have immunity from any diseases that non-CoSers don’t have.

14. Scrambling for stats? Why? Had to write a Knowledge Report lately? Anyone in your life deemed a Potential Trouble Source? Know any SPs personally? Discouraged from sending your kids to non-CoS schools? Do the teachers there have appropriate certification? How many CoS kids attend Harvard or Yale?

15. Are you aware of the difference in quality of life between a CoSer who is “public” and a CoSer who is “staff”? You are probably public, and, as such, you are a wallet to be mined. Sign that billion year contract, become staff, and if you are allowed to (or have time to) get back online, tell us how happy you are then. Be careful not to get sent to the RPF.

16. Is this an unacceptable amount of “entheta”? Is truth “entheta”? Really?! Again, are there any websites or books that you are not supposed to look at? Do you really believe that looking at OT dox above your current level will give you pneumonia or other illnesses? There should have been a massive rise in pneumonia stats over the last two months, then. And, despite it being winter time, guess what? The world is not buckling under an outbreak of pneumonia.

17. Why do CoSers take photos and videos of protesters? What church does this? What purpose do these records serve? Why do critics threaten the church?

18. This might interest you:

* Scientologists believe that psychiatric care / drugs are bad, and discourage or prevent church members from getting needed mental health care.

* Scientologists believe homosexuality is aberrant, and claim they can “cure” it with e-Metering and auditing.

* L. Ron Hubbard has been quoted as saying “there was no Christ” and, in a somewhat contradictory statement, “Jesus was a pedophile.” LOLWHUT?

* L. Ron was tight buds with Aleister Crowley, big-time Satanist. It sounds crazy, but it is true.

* Scientologists wishing to leave the church have to file Knowledge Reports on themselves (typically KRs are used to narc on other Scns) and typically get routed into RPF gulags for up to three years. See Reclamation Project Force for more details.

* Scientology is banned in Germany, and got convicted in Canada.

* Scientologists, including L. Ron’s wife, Mary Sue, were caught infiltrating the IRS and trying to destroy / alter records.

* Scientologists enjoy tax-exempt status, which prohibits the group from taking a political stance. Despite this, they regularly email parishioners “action alerts” telling them who to vote for.

* Lisa McPherson tried to leave the church, was hospitalized after a minor auto accident, was clearly in need of psychiatric intervention, but was spirited out of the hospital and taken to Harrison Hotel by Scns, where she died, covered in roach bites and dehydrated, after ten days. When it was clear she was dying, Scns bypassed 5-8 different medical care center options to drive 40+ miles away to a place that had a Scn physician, and she was DOA.

* Scientologists, to this day, attempt to derail free expression of speech in the USENET newsgroup alt.religion.scientology, using personal ad hominem attacks, “sporgeries” (nonsense spam that clogs up discussion channels) and disinformation.

* Scientologists like to make up false bomb threats and “envelopes filled with white powder” threats against themselves to finger groups that criticize their practices. See also “Operation Freakout,” where reporter and author Paulette Cooper was framed for a bomb threat, harassed in person, nearly driven to suicide, and finally vindicated…after almost 15 years of litigation and personal stress.

* Scientologists in the Sea Org are frequently pressured into having abortions. Babies take time and energy away from Keeping Scientology Working, after all.

* Scientologists who wish to get out often have to leave Scn spouses behind, thanks to the SP / Disconnection Policies. But CoS supposedly doesn’t “break up families.”

* Scientologist children who get out report that they have had crap educations and are ill-suited to life outside the cult. Can you find a contrary example? A child who chose not to be a Scn after being raised within the cult who, nevertheless, thinks they had a great childhood and a great education? They should contact Jenna Miscavige, niece of current church leader David Miscavige, and explain to her why she had it so bad if they had it so good.

So…CoS still sound like a good “product” to you?

As an adult, it is your responsibility to research groups you choose to associate yourself with, and to research them using third party sources, not group-approved materials. As an adult, it is your responsibility to use your critical faculties and common sense. You can choose to duck that responsibility and try to eradicate that pesky “reactive mind” that pricks at your conscience and urges you to use logic, but you do so at your own peril.

If Scientology works for you, that’s awesome. For you. I hope that you feel the same, years from now, when your wallet runs empty and your only friends and “family” are fellow Scientologists, and when all the nonsense you’ve been reading about OT8, Xenu, and dead alien space cooties /
“body thetans” is proven to be 100% true. Won’t you feel silly, then?

And other commenters would be enlightened after doing a search on some of the pro-CoS (albeit very few!) comments here. “TerryEO” is a known CoS apologist who has worn out her welcome all over the ‘net. I spy with my little eye some other familiar names.

Don’t take my word for anything. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH. I won’t be offended if you think everything I have to say is too nutty to be true. With the Internet and traditional libraries at your disposal, you can verify everything yourself, and you should. I suspect you already know what rings of accuracy and truth and what doesn’t, but I urge you to check into it yourself.

Would the CoS be so quick to encourage you to look at (non-CoS) sources? Somehow, I suspect not.

Forgot to add: The FBI investigated the “white powder in envelopes” claims and found NO TIES to Anonymous.

There is a video out, produced professionally by the church, that purports to include a YouTube video from Anonymous making bomb threats. Oddly, this so-called video is hi-def, wide-screen, and not pixelated like a video snorched from YouTube would be.

Clearwater lawyers have been sending out anti-Anonymous videos full of propaganda and misinformation to various citizens in the area. How are these people selected? Their vehicle tags were photographed by CoSers, then their personal data (names and addresses) were somehow “acquired.” Purpose? To scare parents and protesters from expressing their rights to peacefully assemble, and their freedom of speech. Will you stand for that?

In LA, a PI hired by the CoS showed up at a protest packin’ heat. Who brings a weapon to a peaceful protest?

In Atlanta, civilians driving past a peaceful protest were cited for tapping their horns and flashing their lights. Such expressions of free speech have been upheld as legal and Constitutionally protected by a federal court in Michigan. Two protesters were allowed to speak, briefly, on bullhorns, and not warned that this was unacceptable, and then were arrested, not read their Miranda rights, questioned at length, and their personal data (names, addresses) were handed over to the CoS. Also, CoS PIs and members were allowed to video and photograph protesters and vehicle plates. Local DeKalb County police were asked in advance is permits to protest were required and said they were not. Initially the arrests were supposedly due to a lack of permit, but other protesters were allowed to continue to protest anyway. This is contradictory.

Whereas one might believe that anyone protesting knowingly runs the risk of being arrested (even if they protest legally and peacefully), I suspect that the fact that citizens were cited for exercising their rights is much more troublesome and should cause concern.

Also, as noted in comments to a prior article, the CoS in Clearwater did TRY to issue restraining orders, and were turned down twice. The fact that the judge threw out these motions twice and scolded the church for wasting the court’s time with frivolous litigation is information not reflected in the original article here on Product Reviews, but it is information that drastically affects the ACCURACY of the original article.

Again, do not take my word for it. I am merely an anonymous commenter on a website. I urge you to look into these allegations and to make up your own mind, independently. When you speak the truth, you are not concerned about individuals examining your claims and verifying them on their own.

If one really wants to know what Scientology stands for, he should see all the Scientology Videos in the NEW Scientology Video Channel.
Visit Scientology.org
By the way I am very happy about this new web-site!!!
All Scientologists should spread the word that such web-site exists and get all non-scientologists to see it.
Yhey will see what Scientology believes in and the lies of Anonimous and other suppressives will be part of the past….
Very Well Done for this product!!!

Frank G Scientologist

@Something Good

There are two problems with the internal justice system in Scientology:

* A Scientologist is required to use them instead of going to the police
* Senior members of the church are shielded when accusations are made.

Scientology assumes that anyone attacking the organization (by saying one of the senior members had committed a crime) is themselves hiding a crime.

Here’s one story of someone using internal processes and failing to get justice:
http://www.lermanet.com/tomgorman/sexual-assault-nightmare.htm

And here’s a personal account:
http://www.exscientologykids.com/eskforums/viewtopic.php?t=307

“Scientology is a world wide movement with global impact. There are Churches of Scientology even Japan, Israel and S. Africa. And it has missions even in Nepal, India and Kurdistan.”

Oddly enough you don’t call them “Churches” in Israel but rather a secular, self-improvement, tax-paying business. Nor do you call them “Missions” when in India or Pakistan. Why is that Ivan?

Yes, DO go to the biased and one-sided official Scientology website, where your IP address will be logged, to get completely factual and not at all neutral “facts” about how wonderful, helpful and sane the CoS is.

That sounds like a GREAT idea!

Better yet, why not go to neutral third party websites and do your investigation there?

Don’t rely on Anonymous websites. Don’t rely on CoS websites. Go to unbiased news sources who back up their findings with cold, hard facts and make up your mind that way.

If you do choose to go to a CoS website, I hope you know how to use anonymous proxies first. The shiny happy falsehoods there are quite entertaining when compared with the reams of evidence that lead most rational adults to conclude that, at the very least, something’s fishy.

As for “internal justice” in any organization, not just Scientology, why would you seek justice within the same organization that sheltered the very people who abused you in the first place? If your boss sexually harasses you, sure, go to HR or your boss’ boss. But seriously, you should expect better results from your local police or your lawyer…as long as your boss hasn’t paid them first.

Truth is truth. No “overt withholds” or “entheta” here.

Take no one’s word for anything, do your own independent research and analysis and make up yoru own mind. Anonymous is not concerned about what you will find. Anonymous knows that the truth about the CoS is freely available and it does not make the CoS, as an organization, look good.

Concerned that outside organizations and individuals lack the insight that a church member would have? Easily enough resolved. Look into any of a hundred ex-CoS members, many of high rank, many “far along the Bridge to Total Freedom,” and read their accounts. There you go, statements from within the CoS itself, direct testimony from people who were there and intimately familiar with both the good and bad.

What? Disgruntled ex-cultists aren’t reliable? Hmm, perhaps. But if the CoS is so grand, why are there SO MANY ex-CoS folks out there talking? Heck, when someone decides to stop going to temple or a Christian church, they don’t typically feel the need to share the details about why. What’s up with that?

Anonymous WANTS you to look into this controversy independently, and does not demand that you take Anonymous’ word for anything. Do your own research, make up your own mind. Knowledge is free.

The CoS, however, responds to requests that you take nothing for granted and do your own research with links to CoS websites. I, for one, find that both amusing and revealing.

Self-help AMWAY…

Thanks FrankG,
I also highly recommend this website, it doesn’t have as many videos as the official Scientology one, but these videos are real!
http://truthtopplestyranny.blogspot.com/

Bgodley

I find it ironic you use Be Godley as your posting name since Hubbard vilified Christ and Heaven in his speeches and writings on more than one occasion. It is also ironic that a Scientologist is not permitted to “mix practices” that is, attend any *real* religion and their services, whilst that Scientologist is “on Course” or “active as a member”.
I also find it ironic since 1997, no Government given all the actual HCOPL and HCOB communications Hubbard wrote to operate his giant money making scheme, has granted Corporate Scientology any kind of recognition as a “religious body”. In fact the hard but honest truth is Scientology at its core is a failed self help business that grasped an accountant’s brilliant strategy to escape Fraud statutes on false product claims by becoming a “religion”.
In Canada, Scientology last applied for Religious Charity Status in 1997. It did not get that status. Corporate Scientology, at its unadvertised core reflects its founders beliefs that rewarding the downstat is out exchange (helping the poor and needy is bad karma) additionally Scientology holds no theistic belief. It does ascribe to science fiction myth claimed as factual scientific research by the fake Doctor Hubbard. Those *proven Research concepts* (not religious revelation) about aliens , freight trains on Venus and Marcabs ready to invade from Mars, as well as the oft repeated OT3 story, do not legally nor philosophically spontaneously make bad story telling by a third rate 1950s era SF writer into a bonafide religious treatise on the origins of humanity and its possible salvation. Independent review by thoughtful, *fully informed* authorities within a multitude of different Governmental hierarchies have found “Corporate Scientology as nothing more than a business enterprise, governed internally with fascist-like discipline and morals, which maintains a religious facade so as to entice and maintain members while draining their financial and or physical resources only to the benefit of the Corporation and *not* in the least to the benefit of any community the Corporation resides within.”
Worse, Corporate Scientology has a policy directing attacks and attempts at destroying anyone within or without who is a vocal detractor of the Corporation.
This is *not* 20 year old rhetoric. OSA runs on GO comm and tech and the content and directives of the “Fair Game Policy” (while ordered not to be named as such for PR reasons) is *still* mandated as the absolute course to handle PTS who become SP.
Those are the facts.
No PR spin by any OSA poster such as you, Bgodley will ever erase the truth.
If you are not an OSA poster then you are in deep trouble. You have had comm with me. I am a well known and hated SP to the OSA in Canada and in CW.
You must write a KR about contacting me and having comm.
If you are on staff you may be RPF’d in the current climate of Corporate Executive hysteria.
You are not free. Your computer will have the Scieno net nanny on it or you are in violation of policies drafted to keep entheta from entering your mind.
In any event if you are not an OSA appointed or approved respondent to internet entheta, you will be hearing from Ethics and may face a Comm Ev showdown.
Sorry.
“..the criticisms that are off handedly thrown at the Church.”
Not so “off handedly”. Scientology is certainly a powerhouse litigator and as a Corporate Entity can be defamed. McDonalds is an example of defamers being sued and eventually jailed for continuing to criminally defame that Corporation.
Any and all statements about Scientology HCOPL and HCOB based policies, or any allegation made about Scientology past or present conduct would be challenged *if they were not true*. Unpleasant truths are not defaming and C0$ lawyers long ago advised against trying to follow the policy of using lawsuits to harass those detractors since the matters are factually true and it could make the Corporation of Scientology declared a vexatious litigant. Instead Scientology has, when the opportunity presented itself used copy write law as a terrorist sword to conceal its dark side and worthless “technology”.
“I do not have any pretended goal to convince you or some other critics of the merits of the Church.”
Of course you do. You are forwarding the Corporate line of telling an acceptable truth.
“I have a feeling that you don’t really care.”
Actually most of us do. You are a victim and deserve an opportunity to have your freedom from the Corporation. Freezoners practice the Tech and do not have any auditor fearful of being sent to the RPF.
“If you truly cared about people and their plights as you profess in your discussions of the abuse of Scientology you would take a step back and look at yourself and the things you say or incite.”
I have.
There are several other abusers that I have spent considerable time undermining and urging authorities have existing laws applied to their conduct.
I have also been horribly subjected to FG by the OAS even though the government representatives declared my criticisms of the governance and conduct of Corporate Scientology to be factual, educational and therefore not Hate Speech. Scientology sought to destroy me economically, emotionally and socially. I have OSA on tape saying, I would die soon. That I would kill myself. That is the type of threatening behaviour that no “church” would condone or conduct.
Your statement above is ends nicely loaded with the word “incite
Rational and legal criticism does not “incite” any action other than to have the laws of our democracies applied equally to the Corporation of Scientology as it is applied to the Corporation of Ford.
Anyone who incites violence against anyone is of course guilty of a crime.
You imply we are doing something immoral, unethical and/or illegal. That is a reversal of fact. Nicely done. One word. But OSA has had practice hasn’t it. Corporate Scientology has policies in play that are immoral, unethical and illegal if examined dispassionately by the courts. In fact, Corporate Scientology was convicted in Canada based on such an examination. Corporate Scientology’s internal policies of conduct remain unchanged. Therefore the past legal judgementand opinions concerning Corporate Scientologys conduct and policies is still valid after all this time.
“How much trouble do you aid in causing others on your way to some noble goal as you state? It seems you would be willing to slander”
What slander? Slander can be prosecuted by the defamed. Anons are repeating fact. No slander.
” and abuse the rights of thousands”
What rights? To Fair Game a detractor? Is it abuse on our part to decry and seek to prevent the ‘Right ‘Scientology claims to give its members to “invade the homes and abodes” of SPs and harm them in any way without fearing any discipline or sanction by Scientology Ethics?
Do you really seriously think Scientology has the “right” to do those things? Scientology does. Its policy.
“to protect against harassment of some ex-Scientologist as you claim.”
No claim. Fact. And yes, I feel a moral obligation to stand before the black tidal wave of the absolute, judicially noted “clear malice of Scientology” when I can to spare anyone, ex scn or not from your hatred of free speech. I have endured your malice and survived. Not unscathed either. I have some protection now from both my experience dealing with Corporate Scientology malice and by the intervention of the local constabulary warning OSA off.
“There may not be any who find my comments here and understand what I say but I will communicate it nevertheless.”
We hear you loud and clear. But what we hear does not jive with the harsh realities of the operation and protection of Hubbard’s money making Doomsday Machine. Hubbard is gone. The madness continues. It is still posted on your Chart of Organization that “THE ONLY REASON ORGS EXIST IS TO SELL AND DELIVER MATERIALS AND SERVICE TO THE PUBLIC AND TO GET IN PUBLIC TO SELL AND DELIVER TO. THE OBJECT IS TOTALLY FREE CUSTOMERS” Bold face as above on the original. It says customers. Not parishioners. It says the only purpose is retail and to procure more customers to retail to.
It says nothing about worship or salvation. The Chart does not even have the word ‘Church’ in its title. It says “Organization Chart of Scientology”.
You see I have educated myself on Scientology content. Just like I have educated myself on the damaging effects of cocaine use. Even though I have not experienced either, I may express an educated opinion on the toxic effects of both dangerous practices.
These are facts BGodley. Not empty, unsubstantiated, feel good, well practiced, and scripted rhetoric.
“I read a comment section today about Katie Holmes who went out to have some lunch. Just lunch mind you and the comments left were all very harsh, calling her a whore, a mindless robot and other such things.”
That kind of conduct is inappropriate. Such conduct has been condemned by the established and authoritative critics of Scientology for more than 50 years.
Anons through consensus share distaste for such commentary.
That is as abhorrent as Scientology going to Sutton Ontario and parading down the main street of that small town carrying a coffin emboldened with the name of Nan Maclean, resident of Sutton, ex scientologist, Declared SP and then engaged in legal action against the Corporation of Scientology.
“She is a very, very, very sweet person as any who know her would tell you.”
So is Nan Maclean. Yet Scientology, as per *policy* conducted that procession and mock funeral as part of Fair Game in an effort to intimidate and socially terrorize Nan.
“ This is an example of many of Anonymous simply lacking any respect or decency for another person.”
Your statement assumes several things. You attribute that bad behaviour to participants in the Anonymous movement. How do you possibly reach that conclusion? Not only is such behavior not sanctioned by the common consensus that guides the Anons, but equally those people present , total strangers, who berated the insulters commentary are*far more likely* to be participating Anons. However, the ill behaved and the noble in this instance are probably uninvolved in any activism pertaining to Scientology *Management*.
Nice set up to make critics like Anon guilty association with socially inacceptable behaviour.
“This is not about illegal behavior or immoral conduct by the church.”
Oh yes it is. But here comes the “deflection” as per the OSA play book.
“That, I am afraid is a complete ruse.”
Right. And the ruse is?
“This has all the smackings of a con of sorts used to vent as much negative spin in the environment as possible.”
Let me parse that.
“This” – What exactly are you referring to? Ill mannered commentators or factual criticism of Corporate Scientology?
“all the smackings of a con” What deception is being perpetrated by critics?
“used to vent” Used to disseminated.
“as much negative spin”. Unfortunate negative facts.
“in the environment as possible” Reaching as many of the general public as you can and inoculating them against the narcotic sales pitches our FSMs practice so hard in order to get 30% of all those customers ‘religious services’.
There. I cleared that up for you.
No charge. Makes you out exchange. What amends will you make?
“Sound harsh? Nothing harsher by any stretch than what some of your group say and do.”
Yes. The truth about Corporate Scientology is a harsh reality. Some day you may have the courage to face it. We will be there to help you.
The OSA attacks vocal detractors and defectors viciously. I too wonder- “Why do people act this way? Why do they take up this call and mock and degrade beyond anyone else’s stomache for it? It would seem a little off that these folks spend a good portion of their time falling this activity.”
I agree. Why does Corporate Scientology still condone and conduct such abhorrent anti- free speech policies and actions?
“Well, the answer is probably unique for every individual. However, I think we can ask ourselves the same question of why there is a KKK?”
Your guilt by association is so transparent as to be laughable.
KKK wore masks to protect their criminal acts from lawful citizens’ outrage.
Anonymous wear masks to protect themselves against the routine immoral and often criminal acts the Corporation of Scientology condones and conducts against any who express outrage about those acts.
“, why we had the Crusades?”
(Anons were somehow responsible for the excesses of Christian and Moslem zealots clashing centuries ago.)
, why do we have terrorism?,
(Anons are real bad people.)
“why were Christians thrown to the lions?”
Unnamed Anons trying to kill off religious completion? Sort of like CCHR trying to eliminate psychiatry and the overwhelming benefits of properly administered and monitored SSRIs given to patients in need?
“, why do people step on each other on their way to corporate success?”
Because they are Upstat! It is in Hubbard’s management tech. Upstat execs have a right, nay a duty to trample on those above them who are Downstat. Read your own course literature, darn it.
“, and why do we have a culture of dwindling freedoms and antagosism towards our neighbors?”
I don’t know why Scientologists stay in the Corporate culture that restricts their freedoms the farther they advance and institutionalizes antagonism to criticism within and without Scientology.
“I am very certain that this group will say too much too often for too long.”
Anons are taking up the flag of previous critics and benefiting from what we have already established as fact years ago. We are glad to see it. Is 10 years long enough?
“At one point you are going to be asked to prove your claims.”
That point is long past.
It happened about 1997 and earlier.
Before and since then not only are our facts no longer regarded by the courts as “claims” they have in fact been continuously ratified and bolstered by more facts relative to the previously proven ones.
Just which *facts* or, in your parlance *claims* do you contend are untrue in the least?
Actually they have been proven. Many in court and by Corporate Scientology contesting the distribution or disclosure of the very documents which prove many if not all of our claims. You can read them yourself if you can get on a computer not censored by Corporate Scientology.
But then you will have to go off policy and risk failing a Sec Check. You are free, right?
“Not just a posted comment referring to a 30 year judicial opinion”
Judicial opinions about reprehensible Corporate conduct based on policies that remain enforce and unchanged to date. So how exactly is a 30 year old opinion wrong in the least? How is in not applicable today when Corporate Scientology still conducts itself with the same immoral, unethical and often illegal acts, as before?
“or some scorned ex-scientologist but hard cold verifiable proof.”

That is a woefully tired argument. All Scientology apostates are “scorned”. The hard verifiable fact is CSI faced cold hard verified proof of its institutionally sanctioned and conducted abuse of Larry Wollersheim amongst many others. Then CSI proceeded to strip itself of its assets so as to avoid immediate payment of a multimillion dollar judgment. Now that was ethical. The Catholic church in some Diocese have bankrupted itself by *paying* settlements, and not many were bound up by nondisclosure agreements as are most of the many lawsuits CSI has lost based on Cold Hard Facts.
“If on that day you arrive only with the stuff you have already repeated there will be a personal reckoning for you and you will have to answer for your activities.”
Right. Ok. *Ding* the day has arrived. Let us look at the calendar. Its 1997! Where are we? In the Offices of the Deputy Director of Revenue Canada! ( I have complete control over Matter Space and Time because I am an SP7. I get control of Energy when I achieve SP8. I am looking forward to all that sugar coated Viagra.)
What have we here in this presentation? Why it’s all “the stuff you have already repeated”! And it is being submitted as Fact to a Federal Authority! Gosh! What if any of it is untrue, unverified, false or unsubstantiated?! What will the Federal Government of Canada do? First they will ask the Corporation of Scientology if there is anything in the Presentation which they care to dispute as true! Whoops! Corporate Scientology does not contest *any* of “the same old stuff”!
Why?
Because they would have to sit there and watch all those copyright protected un advertised HCOB and HCOPL ( along with all the other corroborating evidence) logged in as publicly accessible evidence in any Appeal they care to file of Revenue Canada’s ruling they were not to receive Religious Charity Status at that time.
“We will see what lies behind this campaign.”
Well it certainly isn’t the Marcabs paying the Psychs running the German Pharmacuetical companies to hire established critics of record to hire street gangs, as the alleged OSA shore story goes……
Your COB already has seen what is behind the campaign. He beat Mary Rathburn up the side of the head for telling him. (Canada has not been kind to DM. The Justices and the Jury Members felt he was lying. Then the Corporation was convicted as a criminal.)
“Truth always wins.”
Not without someone paying attention. We are.
“Alterations and mockery don’t. If Anonymous held cold facts in their hands there would be no need for the mockery and name calling and debased communication.”
If the established facts Anons rely upon were false and defaming the Corporation of Scientology
would have long ago used legal means to eliminate those sources. They tried. They failed. There is no Defamation of Corporate Scientology in the factual claims we deride your Management with and expose to your sheltered often sequestered members and staff.
“Period.”
Darn tootin right.
We told the truth years ago. Proved it.
We and now the Anons still tell the truth. They have far more energy, communication and numbers than we ever had. We applaud there evolution into a powerhouse expression of moral outrage the Corporation of Scientology has been permitted to exist far too long by our weak willed or simply uneducated/indifferent politicians.
Political inertia has spared the Corporation of Scientology.
Anons have picked up the baton and the race towards the oblivion of Corporate Scientology continues.
And that is the facts, Jack.
Period.

Gregg Hagglund SP7
TorontoSP

Anyone who wants to quote this rant, in its entirety in any other forum has my permission.
Now I have to feed, Xenu my cat, a few body thetans.

Hmm. Somewhere above AnonymousInAtlanta
misstated Scientology as being banned in Germany.
I believe he meant Russia.
Putin through them out apparently along with several other illmannered cult operations.
Germany has the4 CoS under a securtiy watch because of Hubbards and therefore Corporate Scientologys’ anti – democratic neo fascist Superman teachings. As well as Hubbards advocacy for “medical and financial cleansing” by mass executions of the ill and poor. Hubbards advocacy of solving the problem of unrepenting SPs in any government he should control by “disposing of them quietly and without sorrow” invokes images of activities the Government of Germany wisely wishes to avoid ever happpening again on its soil.

Gregg Hagglund SP7
TorontoSP

William Hagglund is correct.

Banned in GREECE.
Convicted in Canada.

Watched like hawks in Germany.

Self correction is necessary.
Putin did *not* boot the Co$ from Russia.
It might have been one of the satellites of the former USSR, however until that can be confirmed it will not be claimed.
In a better translation of the article concerning banning the C0$ in Russia it is the “Russian Orthodox Church *calling* for the ban as Scientology has been found out over Hubbards claim Christ was a boy lover.”
However the enraged populace might give the C0$ the boot and unfortunately the Moscow Police are not really making a superior effort to keep order.
The recent 700 strong protest against the C0$ in Moscow was not an Anon event
NO one realy wants to see entry level Scientologists and long suffering staff hurt. But we do want to see the Corporation and its Officers brought to account for a host of illegalities that are clearly covered by the RICO statutes and not prosecuted in the US as they are beginning to be in Europe. We of the ARSCC have been slowly chipping away at the reticence of legal authorities in many jurisdictions to prosecute the US most favored ‘religion’.
In Canada we have already reduced the 10,000 members of the 10 C0$ orgs in Ontario of the early 90s to the 25 people on staff in Ontarios last downstat Org and two missions and the mere 250 members, family and friend at events. ALtho’ Buffalo does bus in more members to make it look good.

If any Scientologist comments again on the millions of members then so some simlple arithematic. Count the number of Orgs in the world. Then divide 8 million ( that is the number from 1999) by that number. Must be pretty crowded at the events right? Crap. You folks are pathetic.
Climb out of Hubbards nightmare and give your talents and abilities an unfettered chance, instead of feeding and supporting Hubbards little fascist run money making machine.

Gregg Hagglund SP7
TorontoSP

From a moderate Scientologist:

“My question is, why doesn’t the church change things?

Lower prices, stop disconnection, stop sec checks, stop tactics.

Wouldn’t the church do a lot better if it had lower prices, didn’t have aggressive selling tactics?

Just open up a lot of small missions in towns that offered cheap auditing, audit everyone up the bridge for cheap, everyone’s happy, world starts becoming a better place.

I just really don’t undersatnd it. I don’t know why the prices need to be so high on things. I don’t know why they need these aggressive selling tactics. It turns people off. “

You and a friend can buy a $10 book tomorrow and do all of the techniques on each other for as long as you want for free.

If you want a more skilled person who has done intensive training for years, a building to go to, and an expert team to assist you, it costs more.

To fix some of the people who spend most of their time lying and upsetting other people, it might cost a lot more.

gotta make that money man. gotta stack cheese. i need at least 300 G’s in my khakis.- L. Ron Hubbard

“You and a friend can buy a $10 book tomorrow and do all of the techniques on each other for as long as you want for free.”

i can go to any other “church” get their book for free and be saved tomorrow as well.

the difference is, i’m not hurting other church members. we don’t disagree with your practices. with disagree with upper management. open your eyes. look at the orgs. no other religion is like this.

we want to help you. their is help on the outside. freezone is free. religion is free. knowledge is free.

“You and a friend can buy a $10 book tomorrow and do all of the techniques on each other for as long as you want for free.”

You might want to check your memos…

I’ve had at least five Scientologists tell me that trying to do that would either drive you crazy or (not kidding) give you cancer.

Ok. If you don’t have $10, you can check out the books in @20,000 libraries.

As for Tony’s comment, my observation is the exact opposite.

Regarding Germany, that country doesn’t exactly have a stellar record of religious tolerance. After 10 years of spying on us, you would think that there would be a mountain of evidence of wrongdoing to use in their campaign of bigotry. But there wasn’t. Thats why Scientologists are still free to practice there.

L. Ron Hubbard never made the comment about khakis. It is just another one of the complete fabrications I see posted here. Some are so ridiculous as to not even deserve a response.

“Ok. If you don’t have $10, you can check out the books in @20,000 libraries.”

can i read OT III for free? how about OT VIII? are those in libraries?

if these materials were so important and the only way to true enlightenment they would be made free. that’s how every other religion i’ve heard of operates.

Stephen PR = dense. That khaki comment was likely a rap lyric not to be taken seriously.

To all of the people saying the CoS has cheap courses, too, those are not the courses that get you further up the bridge. Those are not the ones that get you to PC and OT I-VIII.

Why did Leah Remini write an open letter to all stalled Scientologists if expansion is as you say it is?

Why does CoS have a special tax exemption that no other religious group has despite the evidence in the leaked LEAF emails from CCHR that votes were solicited?

Why are many of the people in the CoS videos not actually who they are labelled? Or, the ones that are accurately labelled, didn’t know they were lending their support to CoS? Why wouldn’t their names be used in these accounts? Why so vague? Mayor of Louisiana? Watch the videos, do some research. Some of those positions are made up. Some of those people no longer hold those positions. And many weren’t aware that they were lending support for CoS but rather giving a thumbs up to “The Way to Happiness” book.

Why, when the going gets tough, does CoS staff insist on falling back on the “don’t you have anything better to do?” defense(Hi, Terryeo…it’s lovely outside, yes. Thank God I’m not in the RPF or I might not see it)?

Why do you see the same people (the same ones that tell us to get a life) posting the same thing everywhere? Google: Scientology + Terryeo, Stephen Paul Reid, GrnApl, Sylver, Lu, Curioser, Marge and others. Is it possible they are OSA? Is it possible they are hatted for making pro-Scientology comments on the internet to get their stats up? Ever seen a pro-Scientology comment that seemed a little out of place and slightly robotic (See “New Scientology.org video channel” comments way above)? Google the entire message and see how it’s been copied and pasted around the net.

Get your paper shredders started ladies and gents…the tide is coming.

Please cite the current laws of Germany or the Post WW2 actions of that nation which in any manner promote or tolerate religious discrimination.

You won’t find any.

The German nation follow the Constitution *we* the conquering allies wrote for them.

Amongst the body of those operating principles for their nation is an absolute intolerance for anything which echoes the Nazi era.
There are also strict provisions for freedom of religious expression and freedom of speech and association.

The Corporation of Scientology operates differently in Germany than in the US. The OSA does not routinely carry out any local FG on outsiders, just on members on course or on staff.
The still do some moderate forms of outside FG, but they are cautious not to push the envelope too hard. OSA farms out strong FG attacks on German critics to third parties and FG thru political/free speech demonstration.

Corporate Scientology in Germany also returns funds much faster to those who clue into the bait and switch fraud and want there money back.

In other words, ever since the German government, after following proper *transparent* procedure, placed Corporate Scientology under a security watch, Corporate Scientology has tried to make nice, as best it can given the HCOPL and HCOB policies that govern the management of the Corporation.
Germany has Corporate Scientology under a security watch not because of any religious intolerance, even though Corporate Scientology is hardly regarded as a religion, but because of the blatantly neo fascist leanings of Hubbards core operations policies. This includes amongst several items, claims he was creating a superior class of Humans (HomoNovis) his endorsement of mass murder of the poor and unhealthy (keeps the streets clean) and his determination, should Scientology ever rule any territory or the planet itself that a significant portion of the population, including the physically and mentally challenged would be untreatable SPs and therefore should Be “disposed of quietly and without sorrow.”
Germany has seen that kind of thinking before.

Corporate Scientology is on the razors edge in Germany as far as being dissolved as a Corporate entity. Sooner or lateer they will slip up badly and be gone from that nation. The practice of Scientology tech outside of the Corporation would of course be constitutionally protected.

Since Corporate Scientology has not altered its internal focus nor repudiated any of the above cited neo-fascist leanings and others (which can be found on the net), therefore the security watch keeps getting renewed in Germany each time it is revisited for re-authorization.

Corporate Scientology trots out the tired and thoroughly discredited claim of “Religious Discrimination” whenever any negative publicity about the Management Practices of Hubbards money making business hits the press. It is an old saw and only sells to themselves.

Lets be clear. On a level playing field, where any government has been given complete access to Corporate Scientologys inner workings and core operating policies, particularly its abhorrence of any charitable practice (rewarding the downstat) Corporate Scientology has been recognised only as a business which operates under an appearance of a religion.
Corporate Scientology has *never* voluntarily disclosed those core documented Hubbard policies, practices and teachings *voluntarily* when under review by any authority.

FSMs make far too much money with that 30% commission on “relgious donations” anyway……

If I were an ex-scientologist SP Corporate Scientology would have my PC folder moved to Ethics and to the OSA for FG ops against me, in violation of the privacy act in Canada. The Corporation would never destroy them as a moral and ethical act, since they could be a good source of blackmail to pressure me into silence.

The scandal in my country is not that the criminally convicted corporation is still here, hanging on by a thread, but the lack of political will to prosecute current criminal fraud and practising medicine without a license (See NOTs 34).

We’ll have to work on creating a little more interest to finally stop and dissolve Corporate Scientology in Canada.
Besides. There are many more practicing Scientologists in the FreeZone in Toronto than Corporate Sanctioned Scientologists in the entire nation.
Thats the fact Jack.
Done by head count at the events vs the active mailing lists of the Freezone.

Gregg Hagglund SP7
TorontoSP

Most of the material as I said is available very inexpensively or for free. There is a very small amount of data that is not available.

And you’re right. We are not like any other religion. That’s the whole point.

These are my personal views as a scientologist. I am not employed by the church, nor have I been asked to respond any comments here.

I just didn’t want rampant bigotry to go unchallenged.

Hey Mr. Sci-Guy Terryeo,

It’s time for some late-night sausage. If you’re late, you ain’t gettin no reach-around. Squeel like a pig boy! *squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee…

<3
Anonymous

Hello there Steven Reid. I enjoyed your comments, they were very informative. To return the favor, I will now save you over $14,000:

THE POWER PROCESSES
L. Ron Hubbard

POWER PROCESS 1

(a) What overt have you committed?
(b) What problem were you trying to solve?
(c) What haven’t you said?
(d) What problem were you trying to solve?

Run the above when there is no TA action on PrPr 4
or when the PC is committing present time overts.
A continuing overt Case is committing overts as a
solution. Continue the process until a floating
needle or there is no more TA action. Then go on
to PrPr 4 (source).

POWER PROCESS 2

(a) “Give me some practices, opinions, or
beliefs you have been connected to whether you left
them or not”. Run to the first blowdown item.

(b) Then take the blowdown item plus the two
items up and two items down from it and assess those
five items to one.

(c) Run on the item; 1. What condition have you
encountered in ____________? 2. How have you
handled it? Run until good indicators, major win, or
F.N.

POWER PROCESS 3

(a) What condition have you encountered in
Scientology (or auditing or dianetics)?
(b) How have you handled it?

Run to a major cognition, goad indicators, or F.N.Power processes 1, 2, and 3 are corrective processes and are used when the P.C. is not running well on Pr Pr 4, 5, or 6. Power Process 2 is used when the pc brings up end words on PrPr5 and is collapsed into his bank by former practices. PrPr 3 is used when the pc has been destroyed by auditing or the organization.

POWER PROCESS 4
(a) Tell me a source.
(b) Tell me about it.
(c) Tell me a no source.
(d) Tell me about it.

The words source, no source and the phrases should
be cleared with a dictionary before runninc the
process. The end phenomena of this process in that
the colors in the room seem brighter and the walls
more solid. Run to this point or to F.N.

POWER PROCESS 5

(a) What is?
(b) What isn’t?

Clear the words with a dictionary with pc on the cans.
Run to a floating needle or 3 consecutive answers in
present time. If pc gives dichotomies (i.e.,
good-bad etc.), go immediately to PrPr 2.

POWER PROCESS 6

(a) Tell me an existing condition.
(b) Tell me how you’ve handled it.

Run to a revivification of the incident that the
pc is dramatising or to a floating needle.

-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/-/
Oh my xenu~! that was a fantastic read! It’s worth every penny of the $14,000 price tag. Dontcha think?

Re: THE POWER PROCESSES

Let’s give some translations for those playing at home.

Overt: An overtly hostile or harmful action; Scientology’s word for “sin”

PC or P.C.: Pre-Clear, a low-level Scientologist (about 90% of their membership)

FN or Floating Needle: A good reading on their homemade lie detector, indicates subject is happy.

“Run to a revivification of the incident that the
pc is dramatising”

This means to relive a painful experience for therapeutic reasons. According to Dianetics, the most probable thing that you would experience is your mother attempting to perform an abortion on you.

wait, so i can now afford to feed my children and don’t have to send them to seaorg?!?!?! wow, thanks guys! now i can be clear and my children don’t have to be slaves. how can i ever repay you?

I don’t need power processes. I’m already on the OT levels, and having a blast.

Ok then OT.
I take it you haven’t reached OT3 yet.
Or if you are OSA you must be OT3 to post.
Doesn’t matter, because you are going to have to do the Bridege all over again now that DM is squirelling the tech.
But let me save you some of your fortune.
There is excellent Scientology tech practised outside of the C0$.
In fact most of the OTs of Scientology are created *outside* of the C0$

From the Freezone:

OT VIII STUDY AND PROCEDURE

TOP SECRET DEBRIEF

Toronto, August 7, 1991

From recall this is a record of the full OT VIII procedure of the C of S as delivered in 1991. It is not the original nor is it a perfect record but it is accurate and will get the result if followed by a competent solo auditor who is flat on all earlier levels with all overts off. The wording of the processes are exact to the best of my recall and the procedures are exact for sure. Any differences are extremely minor (if at all). I spent several weeks reconstructing all this from memory (needless to say I have an excellent memory as a result of the rundown). I am breaking security as I disagree that this should only be released to an elite in C of S.It is the key to the only truth possible.

The whole secret involves what truly is the relationship of the Supreme Being to each individual thetan. To simply say it’s “me” is oversimplified to tears but has some truth to it. The real key is the perception and ability to have full certainty and, therefore, perception on all confusions and distortions of MEST and form and life units as well as the ability to perceive exact identity and its full relationship to its true source and history from its origin as the theta body, the true 8th Dynamic In order to truly view this as a present time beingness one has to clean up, once and for all, his own confusions regarding these points. The key is being flat on all earlier levels and being honest with self as to the truth on each step of the rundown.

In doing this procedure one has to acknowledge the lie of time and persistance and the lie of the illusion that MEST is solid and unchangable. Another key given is the fact that a being can exist independent of time and present time and can chose any point on the track as his present time. The PT body can confuse this, as attention to some degree is always hung up on the PT body. This fixes the thetan into one present time and one time stream when in fact there are many as you will discover.

Do not attempt this rundown if you are incomplete on any earlier level, incomplete on or in need of “sec checks,” involved in any out ethics, PTS or involved in any pressing PT situations that call your attention back to this present time. If you are in need of review on any point above, get it before starting the rundown or it will miss and be meaningless or wasted.

If your attention is in any way governed by OT 7 (NOTS) or earlier materials on OT levels, this rundown will miss and be wasted. This also goes for out int. If int/ext is a concern at all, get reviewed and flattened on OT 1 to 7 before attempting this rundown. The techniques involve simple spotting techniques as in R2 processes or straightwire references.

Step One: Read and word clear Handbook for Preclears cover to cover.

Step Two: Do all steps and exercises in the above book and note reads on any terminals or items [presumably these are used in review or higher levels later]. Keep the ruds in.

Step Three: Listen to the History of Man tapes and star rate M4 the concepts in them (The Time Track of Theta).

Step Four: Clear the definition of “truth” and clay demo it [Tech Dictionary].

Step Five: Clay demo the concept of the theta line branching out toward PT from the “theta body” and how this inhibits exteriorization, ability, power and perception of truth. Clay demo what will happen if someone did OT VIII procedure who was not fully completed on OT VII (NOTS). Sort this out from the above data.

Step Six: Define “know point” in the Tech Dictionary.

Step Seven: Study the early DAB on straightwire in Tech Volume One. Study Creation of Human Ability references regarding spotting objectively and subjectively. Demo “recall,” “spotting” and “return” and how these differ.

Step Eight: This is the processing section which is done solo. Do not fall into running pictures or incidents. In others words, do not use “recall” or “return,” use “spot” only.

[1] Fly the ruds.

[2] Clear and false data strip “truth,” “identity,” “time,” “place,” “form” and “event,” each to EP. Restudy the definitions in the Tech Dictionary.

[3] Clear and False Data Strip the “8th Dynamic,” “God,” “Infinity,” “self,” anyone you have identified as a god and any other wording you may have for the 8th dynamic.

[4] Valence split (Similarity/Difference process) each answer on the reading questions below by alternately spotting differences and similarities between self and the terminal to a blow accompanied by a small blowdown F/N or larger.

[A] Spot a person or object in this L/T or on the backtrack you have identified as or who represented the 8th Dynamic to you. Valence split to EP and then recheck to an F/Ning question on call or thought. End the session for the day and recheck to ensure it’s F/Ning the next day before continuing.

(B) Spot a person who looked/looks like you. Handle as above.

[C] Spot a person who looked/looks dissimilar to you. Handle as above.

[D] Spot a person who is how you wanted/want to be. Handle as above.

[E) Spot a person who is how you didn't want to be. Handle as above.

[F] Spot a person who you’d never want to be. Handle as above.

[G] Spot a person who you want to be. Handle as above.

(H] Spot a person who you identify as self [me]. Handle as above.

End on major stable win on the subject of identity.

Step Nine:

Run as above with Valence Splitting, etc.

[1) Ruds as needed

[2] Spot a being who is close in true identity to you.

[3] Spot a being who has the same experiences as you.

[4] Spot a being who solves things as you have.

[5] Spot a being you are or have been junior or subordinate to as a thetan or in life.

[6] Spot a being who you are/have been senior to in life or as a thetan.

[7] Spot a person who postulates as you do.

[8] Spot a person who you postulate for.

[9] Spot a person who may have postulated for you.

[10) Spot the situation or problem each of the above beings has solved for you. Get prior confusion to the first time ever and spot the first moment of the first prior confusion.

End on major stable win on the subject audited; however, do Step 10 before proceeding.

Step Ten:

Use alternate repetitive straightwire.

End on wins. End section when nothing reads anymore and you have a major stable win.

[1] Spot a truth in self.
Spot a truth in others.

[2] Have another spot a truth in you.
Have another spot a truth in himself/herself.

[3] Spot a reality you have solved with a lie.
Spot a reality you have not solved with a lie.

[4] Spot a reality you have substituted for a truth.
Spot a reality you have substituted for a lie.

[5] Spot a reality another has substituted for a truth.
Spot a reality another has substituted for a lie

[6] Spot a reality you postulated for another.
What did it solve for you ?
What did it solve for him/her ?

[7] Spot a reality another has postulated for you.
What did it solve for him/her?
What did it solve for you?

[8] Have another spot a reality another has postulated in himself/herself.
What did it solve for him/her?
What did it solve for you?

[9] Locate a reality you found safe.
Spot the truth about it. (to a blow, small blowdown F/N or larger)

[10]Locate a reality another found safe.
Spot the truth about it. (to a blow, small blowdown F/N or larger)

[11]Locate a reality another found safe for you.
Spot the truth about it. (to a blow, small blow down F/N or larger)
Have the other person spot the truth about it. (to a blow, small blow down F/N or larger)

[12]Locate a reality you have found safe for another.
Spot the truth about it. (to a blow small blow down F/N or larger)
Have the other person spot the truth about it. (to a blow, small blow down F/N or larger)

[13] Spot a reality you can create for yourself. Postulate a truth for it.

[14] Spot a reality you can create for another. Postulate a truth for it.

[15] Spot a reality you can have another create for you. Postulate a truth for it.

Note: Steps [16] to [19] are a bracket. Each set should blow down on the let go step. End on a win, cog or big change and then do the next step.

[16] Create a future for someone.
Place them in it.
Postulate some truth about it.
Now let go of it

[17] Create a future for yourself.
Place yourself in it.
Place another in it.
Postulate some truth about it.
Now let go of it.

[18] Recall a truth you agreed didn’t happen.
Spot the exact truth in it.
Spot any lie in it.
Now let go of it.

[19] Spot present time moving forward.
Notice thetans agreeing with it:
Spot any agreements you have with it.
Now let go of it.
Spot a different present time.
Notice thetans agreeing with it.
Spot any agreements you have with it.
Now let go of it.
Spot a different present time.
Notice thetans agreeing with it.
Spot any agreements you have with it.
Now let go of it.
(Repeat to a small blowdown F/N, big win)

Step Eleven:

Do all steps to full EP. End on all wins until persistent F/N dies down.

[A] Spot each portion of your theta that was abandoned.

[B] Spot each portion of your theta you asserted was not yours.

[C] Spot each portion of theta you asserted was yours that wasn’t.

[D] Spot your PT creations in this MEST universe.

[E] Spot PT creations that were not yours in this MEST universe.

[F] Spot any old creations that are hung up.
Spot the truth about these to a blow.
Note: Don’t concentrate on the untruths, just the truths.

[G] Spot yourself as a source for various things in this and other universes to full certainty.

[H] Spot another 8th Dynamic creation as independent from yourself. Spot where it is.

[I] Spot points where you have experienced joy or ecstacy in creating in this lifetime and on the back track.

[J] Spot other beings you feel high ARC or love for.
Spot the truths in these beings. (each to a read F/N)

[K] Spot some theta you have created.

[L] Create some theta. Uncreate it. (to a read as it blows off however small it is)

Redo A to L above until the TA floats or a true unkillable persistent F/N appears and you have had a revelation regarding truth or 8th Dynamic creation. This is the end of OT VIII. Note: I wasn’t privy to any C/Singing or review techniques or other EP data. Beyond this there is no confidential EP to my knowledge.

Remember to drink plenty of fluids, eat three meals a day and get plenty of rest.
Then you too can have unlimited sources of energy.

Gregg Hagglund SP7
TorontoSP

@Stephen:

Good for you!

So you have the perfect memory, immunity to AIDS, super IQ, and control over time?

Woooooooow.

Gregg, you obviously have no idea what is on the OT levels.

Stephen Paul Reid,

I have them all.
The originals.
However, I am a scholar and recognised contributor to the Third Party Brief Opposing the C0$ bid for Religious Charity Status in Canada in 1997.
So I have a large and extensive library of materials *you* likely will never be able to afford. And all will soon have to be replaced of course, since just like the basic books DM is going to squirrel them by altering Source. That makes DM an SP doesn’t it?
The OTVIII I posted was originally claimed as copyrighted by RTC in Europe, however there is enough difference in language to consider it not part of the RTC umbrella.
But darn close none the less.
Freeszoners are happy with it.
I’d put up the current actual OT8,( they keep changing) but that would violate copyright. I just give them to Governments upon request or submission. They can violate the copyright if they chose.

How far up the Bridge are you?
Obviously not an OT8, but I’ll bet higher than OT3.
SO you have been thru the wall of fire.
Heh. And of course you have seen the independently verified research that backs up Hubbards claim this is all ‘scientific fact’.
Right?
BTW, how are the locomotives hubbard said he was dodging on Venus? I understand the atmosphere there is rather hard on exposed iron.

Do tell.
Don’t dodge either.
Answer the two questions.
Science Fact?
Surviving locomotives?

Gregg Hagglund SP7
TorontoSP

I have discovered some of these anti-Scientology people are actually anti-religion… all religion is ridiculous according to some “critics”. Scientology is perceived as an easy target because it is a minority religion and people who aren’t Scientologists won’t always come to their defense against the hate speech and discrimination.

And then there are those who are “Free Zone” Scientologists, selling “pirated” Scientology courses and conselling services illegally, without permission of the sanctioned Church – so the motive to dicredit the Official Church is to siphon off actual church parishoners for their own profit. (You know, it’s sort of like saying, “don’t pay your 10% tithe to the yucky Church, I’ll hear your confession for 5%”)

Then there are those who say they are joining the anti-Scientology movement “for fun” — a bunch of idle internet geeks with nothing better to do, playing 80s pop songs and eating cake and “playing” with a religious hate movement.

The good news is that Scientology is becoming more of a household name and it will likely attract more independent thinking people to really look for themselves. The good that real Scientology has to offer will be available for anyone who wants real results – like the Scientology drug rehabilitation program (Narconon) that has a proven success rate of something like 70% or more, and Lord x only knows we need an effective drug rehab progam around here these days!

Love to all,
Matty

@ Matty,

Check your facts:

1. Anonymous is not against religion, it is against the abuses of scientology.

2. Many (early) Freezoners are ex-scientology’s franchisees who were thrown out (in the first meaning of the term) when David Miscavige took over. So, they were authorised to practice until they refused to sign the new contracts DM tried to force them to sign.

3. Anonymous is a open group without means of control. You will find different kinds of people there.

4. Narconon is a scam, based on the Purification Rundown. The methodology is not accepted by any independent body and success rate is a urban myth without merit.

Except for those details, you post is perfectly accurate (;o)

Dear Ann,

Anon is a loose group of individuals with a variety of views, no? I have personally spoken to several Anons who say they are against ALL religion.

Yes, the Free Zone includes ex-Scientologists who were “excommunicated” and are now trying to discredit the official Church to siphon off Parishioners for their own gain.

Yes, Anon is an open group without means of control. Again, we agree. Therefore, the exaggerations, false claims of criminality against the Chruch and other acts of dicrimination and harassment against Scientologists are ALSO out of control. That means any whack job can call themselves “anonymous” and put a mask on and do and say anything they want. This includes “anonymous” threats against members of the religion and epithets such as Sci-fags and other hate leveled at innocent members of the Chruch.

Scientology’s Narconon drug rehabilitation 70% success rate is confirmed by many independent sources. And yet, random anonymous people on the internet can make any accusation they want and “independent” verification is non-existent.

Love to all,
Matty

Some “members” of Anonymous have told me that they are not just Anti-Scientology, they are Anti-Religion.

Anon includes a bunch of individuals who are participating for individual reasons. Some of them are internet geeks who are attacking Scientology for “fun”.

Yes, some Free Zone members have been “excommunicated” from the Official church, I agree with you. And “Free Zone” Scientologists are trying to start their own form of Scientology so if they discredit the church they can try to siphon off members for their own personal gain.

Yes, Anonymous is an open group without means of control. Again, I agree. This means that any whack job can make whatever accusation they want and spread it all over the internet and everywhere, and there is no verification of their claims.

I have been told that the Church is a murderous criminal organization and haven’t been found guilty of all of these crimes because they have infiltrated the Government. This is just a crazy assertion!

In the meantime, this “anonymous” movement creates a hostile tone toward people who choose to be members of this religion and potentially creates unfair discrimination and harrassment against Scientologists’ free practice of their religion.

All you have to do is browse the sites for such epithets as Sci-fag and other hateful sentiments toward innocent people who just want to practice their religion in peace.

Love to All,
Matty

Matty,

You’ve missed the mark all over the place. The -fag extension is used for everything. It stemmed from a quote that essentially went “I’m gay for X” that eventially got shortened to Xfag. The Anons aligned against the CoS are often called Xenufags or Moralfags. It’s a nondiscriminatory suffix that is also used in location identification such as the DC Anons are called DCfags. The negative conotation you attach to it is your business.

I’ll consider your mark missed. Next,

Some members of Anonymous ARE anti-religion. So? Some of us are women, too. Does that make us all women?

Some members are internet geeks who are in it for teh lulz. So? Many more of us aren’t. Many more of us are well outside the CoS’ stereotype of Anonymous being teenage internet geeks.

The Freezone wasn’t setup to siphon CoS members. It was setup, originally, by Scientologists who left or were discharged from CoS when SP #1 DM came in and started squirreling the tech and creating an out ethics CoS. Guess what other group, still in existence, formed before the CoS in 1950, broke away from Hubbard and the CoS? The California Association of Dianetic Auditors.

Yes, any whack job could carry out something in the name of Anonymous. Any whack job like an OSA member? Something like a fake bomb threat? How is Paulette Cooper these days? Is she still on surveillance?

Haven’t been found guilty of all these crimes, eh? Well, that’s funny, if you google Scientology convictions, you’ll find a ton of cases where they’ve been found guilty. The most recent being Martine Boublil and the Belgium “Criminal Organization” trial. Nice try, though.

Anonymous hasn’t forced the churches hand in anything and has constantly stated that it is the CoS and the abuses it commits that we wish to stop. The CoS drew this in and your boss is why.

Have a nice day, Matty
<3 Anon.

@ Matty,

“I have personally spoken to several Anons who say they are against ALL religion.” Yes, there are individuals that are against all religions, others that are not.

“Yes, the Free Zone includes ex-Scientologists who were “excommunicated” and are now trying to discredit the official Church to siphon off Parishioners for their own gain.” It is funny that you mention money about them but not about scientology, which greed is well documented.

“That means any whack job can call themselves “anonymous” and put a mask on and do and say anything they want. This includes “anonymous” threats against members of the religion and epithets such as Sci-fags and other hate leveled at innocent members of the Church.” That is one of the problems we face, and it is not a small one. But when individual scientologists do something wrong, it is not right to incriminate the church as a whole, except if these individuals apply a policy (fair game, disconnection, no “psy” medicaments, etc.)

“Scientology’s Narconon drug rehabilitation 70% success rate is confirmed by many independent sources.” I would be more than happy to read them if you were kind enough to provide me with the references.
___________

“Some of them are Internet geeks who are attacking Scientology for “fun”.” That is true, unfortunately. I personally prefer those who criticize the abuses of scientology.

““Free Zone” Scientologists are trying to start their own form of Scientology so if they discredit the church they can try to siphon off members for their own personal gain.” Many of them claim that they practice the true scientology, the one in practice before David Miscavige and his minions began to alter the Techs. Never heard of the “Basics” ? Why do you think LRH never touched that himself ? For the early ones, he had decades to reconsider.

“I have been told that the Church is a murderous criminal organization and haven’t been found guilty of all of these crimes because they have infiltrated the Government. This is just a crazy assertion!” About infiltrating federal agencies, it is absolutely true. Google “Operation Snow White” and learn about Mary Sue Hubbard going to prison with 10 others top scientologists. It is also true that scientology is good at silencing critics who could bring cases to justice. Google “Operation Freak Out” and learn what id did to Paulette Cooper. Maybe scientology never killed anybody, but there are numerous cases of suspect deaths. Google “Lisa McPherson” and learn about her fate.

“In the meantime, this “anonymous” movement creates a hostile tone toward people who choose to be members of this religion and potentially creates unfair discrimination and harassment against Scientologists’ free practice of their religion.” The word “potentially” should be written in capital. And if you are not able to treat your problems from inside, then expect some forms of gentle pressure from outside.

“All you have to do is browse the sites for such epithets as Sci-fag and other hateful sentiments toward innocent people who just want to practice their religion in peace.” To be honest, “fag” terms are used in link with other categories of people (e.g. Britfag)and by a minority of people within anonymous (I refer here mainly to Enturbulation). Hateful sentiments are usually reserved to the top management who maintain and reinforce the scam part of scientology. many people have a lot of compassion for the basic parishioners.

Matty,
Let us cut all the dancing around.
Narconon is a fraud.
Absolutely.
In 1999, in a spectacular lawsuit Narconon suffered a serious defeat in Baden-Wuerttemberg. In Narconon’s lawsuit against the state of Baden-Wuerttemberg, Narconon was not able to produce a single, cured patient.
That is right. Not one. Period.
From the entire planet.
GET IT YET?
And no real proof since either.
In fact there are no independent scientifically verifiable studies that support the Purif as having any efficacy, other than dehydration and possible weightloss.
Serious side effects from Vitamin overdoses are well documented.
Sorry Matty you have been had by the Management of Scientology.

That aside, let us deal with your other Management taught delusions.

I think everyone in or out of Scientology will concede that when it comes to KSW, Scientology will take on anyone, big or small, and will not permit its name to be besmirched without complaint or action, especially if defaming statements are repeated over and over and disseminated world wide.

Now C0$ hates me. No question. So badly have they pursued the (no longer called Fair Game) Fair Game policy against me and my family in Canada, they were faced with Criminal Harassment Charges.
The C0$ escaped those charges only by ceasing FG attacks on me, my family and my associate critics.

C0$ hates me for two reasons.

First, I publish these statements often.
They are all true.
Therefore not Defaming.

Scientology Management does not always tell the truth;
Scientology Management has condoned, conducted and been
convicted of illegal,unethical and immoral activities;
Some Scientology Practices are dangerous to participants health,
either physical or mental or both;
Scientology Management and L.R. Hubbard lied about Hubbards life
history and accomplishments;
Despite the pseudo-scientific claims of Hubbard no Scientology or
Dianetic process has *ever* been clinically *proven* to work as
claimed.

I have been circulating the above, in one form or another
since 1999.

Were the above not true, then they would be defamations of
Corporate Scientology and we both know Co$ has the money and the
lawyers to force me to retract or cease to utter or print them.

But the above *are* true.
And the first four are enforced by *current* Co$ policies.

The second Reason C0$ has determined to *destroy me* unless restrained by the law, is pure malice and spite for their utter defeat when the criminally convicted cult attempted to procure Religious Charity status in Canada, by submitting incomplete and in some instances false documentation to Revenue Canada. I changed that.
I supplied the Government with the documents C0$ would not and thus corrected the situation. Based on complete disclosure, the Government concluded C0$ served no Charitable purpose and even taught charity as inappropriate behaviour.(Rewarding the Downstat is out-exchange) C0$ also provided *no visible benefit to any community in which it resides.* They were also unimpressed with Hubbards murderous attitude towards the ill and poor.

So Matty, get a clue.
Co$ manangement has been deceiving you.
Sorry, but that is the unvarnished truth.
It doesn’t matter if a Saint or a Sinner tells you the real facts, those facts are not changed by the state of the messenger.

William G. Hagglund

Stephen Paul Reid,

Don’t dodge and answer the questions.

Are there locomotives on Venus like L. Ron said?

Have you been to the Van Allen Belt like Ron?

Some questions are so ridiculous as to not deserve a response. If someone asked you why your head is on backwards, would you answer them?

It’s really difficult to have a discussion about illegal activities with someone who doesn’t know the difference between 1) a rumor 2) an accusation 3) a charge and 4) a conviction.

There is court documented evidence that former Scientologists have grossly exaggerated and even sometimes lied under oath against the Church. Often they are paid by a handful of attorneys and business men who thought suing the church might be a good investment.

Sometimes you even find some truth in the media coverage of these things.

http://www.sptimes.com/2002/06/13/TampaBay/Scientology_turncoat_.shtml

“Scientology turncoat taken to task”
“The millionaire testifying on behalf of the church “is in all manner of trouble,” a judge says.”
By DEBORAH O’NEIL, Times Staff Writer
© St. Petersburg Times
published June 13, 2002

——————————————————————————–

“ST. PETERSBURG — New England millionaire Robert Minton came forward recently to say he wanted to set the record straight about lies he told in a wrongful-death lawsuit against the Church of Scientology…”

“…For five years, Minton, once a vocal Scientology critic, gave Tampa attorney Ken Dandar as much as $2-million to fund the case against the church. But in recent months, Minton has said he lied under oath at Dandar’s urging…”

I don’t have a religion – why? – because as a child i saw that a Science fiction writer can set up a religion, pretend at playing “God”,cause all manner of abuse and hurt to good people, justifying these abuses by saying “we are the only ones that can save the planet.” L. Ron Hubbard did not save the planet,Scientology didn’t save L. Ron Hubbard.He apparently left his body to do better works elsewhere, Where?
L. Ron Hubbards’ elite Sea Org policies ruined my Dad, broke my heart and caused shattered lives. L. Ron Hubbards elite Sea Org didn’t just break my family,they did the same thing to many families. This still goes on today.
Tell me Scientologists – What right does a “religion” have to tear families apart? Breaking families up is just one of the abuses of Scientology, there are many,many more.
See – http:// exscientologykids.com/
http:// scientologydisconnection.com
http:// xenu.net
http:// xenutv.net
http:// Lermanet.com
http:// ExScientologistMessageBoard
These are just a few websites that have masses of information,testimony, court cases, and personal accounts of people whose lives have been shattered by this so called “religion.” What kind of a “religion” does all the documented things on the above websites to people, then pretends to the world it is doing good?

To quote L. Ron Hubbard from the Shrinking World of L. Ron Hubbard
Journalist:But surely its authoritarian in its’ treatment of suppressive people that kind of thing, i mean you don’t allow criticism.

Hubbard:Oh no a suppressive isn’t critical, a suppressive is a person who denys the rights of others.

Journalist:But surely you are doing precisely that thing to them by denying them the right to do what they want to do.

Hubbard:Perhaps,but if somebodys’ going to kill a baby I think you would deny him the right too.This is beside the point.The only thing, the only reason why any discipline has had to enter the scene, and the government should be very glad of that discipline is to keep the lunatic fringe and from other people exploiting this subject and victimising people with it.

Hubbard:Why do they just fight it and say theres’ something bad but they never specify whats bad.They haven’t specified,For instance, right now they say we’re breaking up marriages. Why ,thats a lie.As a matter of fact they’re saying that at the moment when you’ve got this book which was just about to go on the press is “how to save your marriage” because it contains thousands of successful marriages.

“A suppressive person is a person who denys the rights of others”
L. Ron Hubbard did a lot of this.

“if somebody is going to kill a baby i think you would deny him the right”
Yes, i agree and you would also deny the right to take a child away from their parents.

“that discipline is to keep the lunatic fringe and from other people exploiting this subject and victimising people with it.
But its’ ok for Co$ to exploit this subject and victimize people with it.

Thank you to Mark Bunker at Xenutv. com for the extracts from the transcript of The Shrinking World of L. Ron Hubbard.
And
Thank you to Anonymous for making a stand and exposing the things that are bad.I think you have specified.

Now that it’s unpopular to riducule their beliefs, and it’s been proven that Scientology is not a criminal organization, the plan is to try to blame them for “breaking up families”.

That’s even harder to prove and much easier to spread rumors about. Sometimes families break up, even in religions where divorce is forbidden. If someone in my family was spreading false rumors on the internet about me or my religion, I might not want to speak to them either. Criticism is one thing and vicious attack is another.

It’s a very sad situation when families break up, but I don’t understand the logic behind blaming the church. It sounds like a mini-holy-war, and holy wars never end. Maybe telling the truth, not exaggerating things, and not blaming a whole religion for what some individuals do would be a good start to a resolution.

Harriet — stop the pretense of hand-wringing. Scientology can hardly assume the mantle of victimhood in the face of the increasing public knowledge of and opposition to Scientology’s true aims.
It’s obvious from your attempt to categorize this as a “vicious attack” that you, as a Scientologist, have a vested interest in trying to portray the vicious cult as a victim.
On the contrary, a wealth of evidence proves that the threat of Scientology has been deliberately concealed and has therefore been vastly underestimated by the public.
Families occasionally break up of their own volition, true. However, the Church of Scientology FORCES disconnection on its adherents in order to isolate them and protect its system of indoctrination and control.
February 10th protests focused on publicizing the “church’s” negligent homicide of Scientologist Lisa McPherson and the subsequent coverup.
March 15th focused on revocation of the tax exemption the “church” wrested from the IRS in the early 1990′s by harassing, intimidating, suing and blackmailing IRS staffers and leaders.
April 12th will stress a more compassionate stance toward members, who are, after all, merely prey — duped, defrauded, and abused by the “church.” The hope is that these virtual prisoners will again be able to freely enjoy the support of their families.
It’s been well established in many court proceedings that Scientology is absolutely a criminal organization. These are not isolated incidents, or ones committed by rogues — they are part & parcel of the Scientology creed and administration. Eleven members of senior leadership of Scientology — including founder L. Ron Hubbard’s WIFE — were convicted of and served jail time for infiltrating government offices and stealing protected documents.

As for your attempted “holy war” characterization — it can’t be a “holy war” because there’s nothing holy about the Church of Scientology. No God, no higher power, no morality. Scientology is not a religion, it’s a corporation, and one guilty of mafia-style bullying.

Please, readers, do not take my word for it. My language is vehement because I have read source documents, from L. Ron Hubbard himself, that outline alarming intent and methods.
I strongly encourage you to Google Scientology. Read as many of its documents/policies as possible from xenu.net, wikileaks.org, exscientologykids.org, xenutv.com. There are many sources of these previously unknown policies, and we as citizens should be informed about the menace working its way into our lives.
I’ve read those documents. They prescribe a full-scale attack on society, a plan to infiltrate the government and all social structures in order to bring about a world completely ruled by Scientology. In their worldview, there are only three categories of people: Scientologists, naive potential converts, and those who resist and must be destroyed.

Please, please research the “church.” If it were to succeed in its goals, many of us would be “disposed of quietly and without sorrow.”

@Liberty Belle

The “criminal organization” line has already been discredited. When one tactic fails, anonymous morphs.

You should get with the program. There is a new line of attack now.

http://www.scientologymyths.info/anonymous/

@ ^^^

Well, pro-Scientology “anonymous,” I guess I’m old-fashioned, since I’m considerably older than the average protester you’ve met.

The truth never goes out of style, and the “church” of Scientology is absolutely criminal, proven in court, leaders convicted and sentenced to prison sentences they served.

Prepare yourselves for the next round of indictments, trials, convictions and sentences, because they are coming, without question.

It only takes the tiniest scratch in the surface of the “church” for poison to come oozing out of that fakey, benign exterior.

I think I’ll just stick to the facts, despite your pathetic try at redirecting me to Scientology propaganda. Kthxbai.

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